Carbon Build up...Is this a good idea?

[Rudy R]

my disco has carbon build up.
you may have seen my post about cleaning it out with water.
I also have put Sea Foam in the fuel tank.


today some one told me to try, airplane fuel it has something like 110 octane, to use 5gal mix with reg fuel and that would burn out all the build up. he and his buddys had done this on street rod in the past.

what are your thoughts:

[drg]

Avgas won't do anything to clear out the carbon build-up. On a very high-compression street rod, putting Avgas in can give you better performance for that tank, and maybe if you drive the snot out of it for that tank it might burn off some carbon, but that's an indirect benefit at best.

Your truck will probably have less detonation for that one tank, because of the high octane, but there won't be any lasting changes. It won't burn off the carbon unless you drive with your foot to the floor for a whole tankful.

Plus, Avgas is usually leaded, and that will hose your O2 sensors AND your cats. Probably not in a tank or two, but it will eventually.

I'm considering trying the Sea Foam in the intake manifold trick, but I don't think I have bad carbon fouling, so it would just be preventative for me.

[Disco Mike]

Rudy,
If you have a bad case of carbon build up I would suggest you use either 3 cans of SeaFoam or the 3 pack from B&G. B&G is by far the best and costs more, but SeaFoam will do a pretty good job also.
With either of the products, one can goes in the fuel tank, one in the crank case and one thru the induction system( intake manifold). Make sure you start with a fresh oil change and change it again as soon as it gets dirty, usually around 1000 to 1500 miles. When you do the induction cleaner, clean the throttle body with some carb cleaner and a rag, then do the induction cleaner slowly over 3 or 4 minutes. Shut the engine off as soon as you are done with the induction cleaner and let it sit for 1/2 hour before hitting the road. Be prepared for a lot of smoke for the first 15 minutes of driving.
With any of them, plan on doing it when you have a full tank of premium and 2 or 3 hours to go drive.
Don't use Avgas, you will burn the valves and screw up you O2 sensors.
In the future, depending on how much you drive, throw in a can of SeaFoam or B&G in the fuel tank, once or twice a year, your truck will continue to run strong.
Good luck,
Mike J.

[Muddy Oval]

Actually, AvGas will make it worse. Higher octane fuel leaves MORE carbon in an engine that isn't high enough in compression and advanced enough in timing to use it. Horrible idea. Besides, the carbon isn't where the gas goes on the combustion chambers most likely, it's on the backs of the valves where the induction cleaner will do the job.

[02RhinoRange]

Has anyone used seafoam on a P38? There's just so many darn electronics, don't wanna falt the system, or screw up the MAF while doing it. I'd hate to make a trip to the dealership because I screwed up the Seafoam procedure, or because the Rangie doesn't like seafoam.

[BlueLion]

First, I would suggest a good bottle of fuel injector cleaner once a month. I would suggest you use the Gumout Truck formula. Secondly, as we all know anything with a V8 in it loves gas, and moreover, they are kinda like women, they have needs. Thus, any old Hot Rodder will tell you every now and then you have to stand on a V8 to get the carbon blowed out. Well, I have had my truck a month now and have been driving sensible, but at the same time I knew I had to stand on it. Well, I did, I floored it Sunday while merging and my idle improved as I knew it would. This was obviously noticeable at the stop light. Now, after that it was back to sensible driving, and I will drive it like this another 5 or so thousand miles and I will floor it again.

[Muddy Oval]

I would suggest using BG fuel system cleaner instead. The inexpensive ones are usually just alcohol based and are warned against by Land Rover.
Seafoam won't fould the MAF because you introduce it into the plenum so the MAF is upstream.

[acornhoek]

Seafoam and B&G are both great products…….BTW just because Seafoam is less expensive doesn’t make it less effective. The thing to keep in mind w/ both is that neither claims to be effective on exhaust valve carbon – the bigger problem for our V8s. Ignition burns up their effectiveness before they can make it to the back of the exhaust valves and their respective stems. Your engine isn’t 100% efficient so some of it makes its way there…..not much though.

The point of dripping water into the intake (same place for Seafoam on throttle body) is that the H2O turns to steam, and the steam heads out & cleans the back of the exhaust valves & their stems. The water does increase the octane so you’re not looking to dump copious amount into the system all at once.

Now for some actual experience w/ using H2O. 5-6 years ago I purchased a D1 from an owner who was very up front about the carbon build up in the engine. It was misfiring all over the place and was, according to the dealer & an independent LR shop, in desperate need of a valve job as the exhaust valves were sticking on multiple cylinders. This is what I did:

Pulled the Stepper & cleaned it.
Cleaned the MAFS
New air filter
Replaced the vacuum lines to the plenum & cleaned the oil separator on the right valve cover

Seafoam in crank case for 15 minutes @ idle then drain & drop the oil pan to clean it out
*Don’t want to send that sludge/ crap back through the engine. When I put the pan back on I wasn’t looking to for the perfect seal because I was going to do this again
Put new oil filter on & refilled w/ synthetic

Can of Seafoam in the fuel tank
1/3 can Seafoam through TB vacuum line @ idle
Rest for 30 minutes then drive it around
1/3 can Seafoam through TB vacuum line @ idle
Rest for 30 minutes then drive it around – yes, 2nd time
1/3 can Seafoam through TB vacuum line @ idle
Rest for 30 minutes then drive it around – yes, 3rd time
*Things were already starting to smooth out, but I could see w/ the vacuum gauge that exhaust valves were still sticking intermittently

1 ltr of water slowly dripped through TB vacuum line @ idle
*I only dripped at the rate that the computer could keep up w/ the higher octane created by the water – idle became smooth & vacuum gauge was no longer showing sticky valves (even while driven around town)

Seafoam in crank case again for 15 minutes @ idle then drain & drop the oil pan to clean it out again
Cleaned everything up then put the pan back on w/ Great Stuff for a nice tight seal
Put new K&N oil filter on & refilled w/ synthetic
1/3 can Seafoam through TB vacuum line @ idle
Rest for 30 minutes then drive it around

*Exhaust was coming out clean by now so I did it one more time for good measure
1/3 can Seafoam through TB vacuum line @ idle
Rest for 30 minutes then drive it around

The truck ran like new…..very smooth & responsive, and the dipstick came out honey colored by the next oil change @ 3000 miles. BTW, change the oil about every 3000……not 4000, not 5000, not 6000…..you get the picture.

Total cost was under $100 but the way I saw it was that even if I still did a valve job on it, cleaning out what I could before I pulled the heads was a good start. Engine ran beautifully and the codes never came back, so I ended up keeping it on a good maintenance routine and worked on other things.............never reared its head again.

[Rovin4life]

I prefer the 44k from BG.

the fuel cleaner does work better then the injection cleaner that is introduced in either the intake or fuel rail. Reason is as stated before it hits the intake side first.

[Disco Mike]

Originally Posted by beezel

I prefer the 44k from BG.

the fuel cleaner does work better then the injection cleaner that is introduced in either the intake or fuel rail. Reason is as stated before it hits the intake side first.

I agree wit Beezel,
B&G products far out perform over the counter products especial when you use their 3 pack which includes the 24 K for the fuel tank, a spray can of throttle body cleaner and the induction cleaner that really works on the valve carbon problem.
Mike J.

[Muddy Oval]

Seafoam did wonders for my 95 Disco... BG is better, but Seafoam did what I needed it to. Induction cleaners are important because the usual place on the Rover V8 that gets carboned up is the backs of the valves. Cleaners in the fuel will NOT clean the backs of the valves.
Another reason water works is because carbon will dissolve in water. The steam helps too, but the water on the backs of the valves will help remove the carbon- except sometimes it releases in chunks which is bad.

[Rovin4life]

we had a disco that swallowed some coolant into the oil passages. Didnt ruin the engine but it sure made it easy to clean though.

[Rudy R]

my truck is running a little better but not 100% yet. I have put sea foam in the engine, the fuel tank aswell as the TB. I think the carbon chunks are giving me trouble.

I am checking in to the BG stuff.

so were do I find the ...

stepper??

MAFS?

plenum?

oil separator on the right valve cover
(is their one on the left?)

[Disco Mike]

Rudy,
It is not an over night fix no mater what you use. What exactly is your truck doing that comcerns you?
B&G is usually found at the dealers parts deptments as well as many independents, you won't find it at an auto parts store.
Your oil separator is on the right side(passanger side) valve cover, none on the left side.
B&G does have a locator system on their web site.
Let me know what you are trying to correct, also your mileage and past maintance, before you go to B&G,
Mike J.

[Rudy R]

I e-mailed you please call me