New Engine install isuues to resolve.

[CTP]

I purchased an HSE Callaway about two weeks ago. Very nice and clean vehicle. This is my first Rover ever! Well, it is very clean but it had a blown engine. Thrown rod thru the cylinder wall. And purchased a lower mile unit. Figured a GEMS was the one and dropped on in, hoping it would work. Upper Callaway plenem and air flow sensor swapped from original engine. It does run and idles fine but at around 2k RPM it misfires. I have been studying the Gems manual posted here. Codes curently come up with is " misfire catalyst damage fault bank a" and before that: "misfire excessive emissins fault". To remedy so far I have: gasketed plenum and upper intake, cleaned MAF, new plugs (champion), new wires, fuel pressure sensor, checked compression and coils. Next to me would be to suspect Cats and MAF though no other codes are reading. Does the first code mean catalyst damage is causing the misfire or the other way around? Can I solve this with my standard code reader? Is there anyone near me (central ohio) willing to lend a hand? I have just found my battery is bad and won't hold a charge too. Thanks for any help.

[Elemental]

Originally Posted by CTP

I purchased an HSE Callaway about two weeks ago from a local salvage dealer. Very nice and clean vehicle. This is my first Rover ever! Well, it is very clean but it had a blown engine. Thrown rod thru the cylinder wall. Anyway I figured.... even if it needed a new engine.. it would be worth it, etc, etc. And purchased a lower mile unit. Figured a GEMS was the one and dropped on in, hoping it would work. Upper Callaway plenem and air flow sensor swapped from original engine. It does run and idles fine but at around 2k RPM it misfires. I have been studying the Gems manual posted here. Wonderful data! Thanks!Codes curently come up with is " misfire catalyst damage fault bank a" and before that: "misfire excessive emissins fault". To remedy so far I have: gasketed plenum and upper intake, cleaned MAF, new plugs (champion), new wires, fuel pressure sensor, checked compression and coils. Next to me would be to suspect Cats and MAF though no other codes are reading. Does the first code mean catalyst damage is causing the misfire or the other way around? Can I solve this with my standard code reader? Is there anyone near me (central ohio) willing to lend a hand? I have just found my battery is bad and won't hold a charge too. Thanks for any help.

Did you put a long block 4.6 from a non callaway in there, or di dyou reuse the heads?

In other words, what parts did you use that DIDNT come with your Callaway?

[CTP]

I installed a used 82k mile long block GEM motor. The only parts I switched over from the Callaway engine are: flywheel, upper manifold and plenum, coil pack, MAF and fuel rail. I realise the system is designed for use with all of the intake parts but it seemed promising that my code count deminished with the remedies applied so far. Are the heads on the Callaway so different? Could I swap the ECU with a standard GEMS unit to resolve?

[Elemental]

Originally Posted by CTP

I installed a used 82k mile long block GEM motor. The only parts I switched over from the Callaway engine are: flywheel, upper manifold and plenum, coil pack, MAF and fuel rail. I realise the system is designed for use with all of the intake parts but it seemed promising that my code count deminished with the remedies applied so far. Are the heads on the Callaway so different? Could I swap the ECU with a standard GEMS unit to resolve?

The ONLY thing you could have used was the short block. The heads and intake are port matched, and the intake gasket for the Callaway is different.
There are other differences...I have the new product book at home from 99. But I can tell you if you used "regular" 4.6 heads and intake gasket, It isnt gonna work right. This isnt a ECM problem.

Edit... You used the non callway intake and heads? The correct fix is to use the right parts. Replacing your PROM would have uncertain results, and is kind of ghetto.

[CTP]

I didn't swap out the intake manifold and gasket. I am only trying to use the Callaway upper parts, ie the stacks box (with throttle sensor), intake tube, Maf sensor.

[Elemental]

Who knows. Its the wrong parts for the car.... The correct fix is the Callaway heads/Intake and Ported gasket. Thats what I woudl do.

But, its your truck.

[CTP]

Yea I have to agree. Guess I was just hopefull that they would be close enough. Gonna have to put them to use I guess.

[CTP]

My decision to attempt the swap with minimal Callaway components being used is also based upon the fact that the Gems short block I have gotten is not the higher compression one in the Callaway anyway. Will adding the top end with heads and all even work because of this? My situation with funds, etc. leads me to look at these posibilities with hope to improve towards ideal in the future. So, my original question is whether or not the Callaway ECU will run a standard Gems motor? Based upon the info I have read the standard computer does allow for some flexibility in components and sensors. All of the sensors are the same. The upper intake is the same except for shorter stacks and Carbon Fiber tube. The cam probably is different though. The Callaway ECU is different I know with programming and the chips being soldered in. Maybe it won't work. Isn't it iffy either way I go though? At this point could it be that I have a bad Catalytic converter causing a rich mixture and missfires, etc? Couldn't a bad MAF also be at fault? Why did the original Callaway engine throw a rod? I don't know. These components are from that setup though. Is a 1313 code indicating a bad conveter or damage happening to the converter because of excessive emissions?

[Elemental]

Originally Posted by CTP

My decision to attempt the swap with minimal Callaway components being used is also based upon the fact that the Gems short block I have gotten is not the higher compression one in the Callaway anyway.

THe 4.6 SHort block is the same. The compression bump comes from the heads.

Will adding the top end with heads and all even work because of this?

Yep.

My situation with funds, etc. leads me to look at these posibilities with hope to improve towards ideal in the future. So, my original question is whether or not the Callaway ECU will run a standard Gems motor?

When the check engine light is on, does it blink at the rate of once per second? How does the engine run?

Based upon the info I have read the standard computer does allow for some flexibility in components and sensors. All of the sensors are the same. The upper intake is the same except for shorter stacjs and Carbon Fiber tube.

Its also ported.

The cam probably is different though.

No. Its the same.

The Callaway ECU is different I know with programming and the chips being soldered in.

They are not soldered in, they are changeable. However, the transmission is set up differently and controlled by the GEMS computer too.

Frankly, using the PROM from a regualr 4.6...I dont know what will happen. It could go either way.

Maybe it won't work. Isn't it iffy either way I go though? At this point could it be that I have a bad Catalytic converter causing a rich mixture and missfires, etc?

No. The cat does not effect mixture. You are runnign rich for some reason under the hood.

Couldn't a bad MAF also be at fault?

Could.

Why did the original Callaway engine throw a rod?

Want my guess. I've seen this happen more then once.

The fuel injector leaks so badly that it fills the combustion area.. The piston comes up and cannot compression the fluid and bends the rod. After driving for a while, the bend gets worse untill it cracks in half.

That woudl be consistant with having a misfire like you describe.

I don't know. These components are from that setup though. Is a 1313 code indicating a bad conveter or damage happening to the converter because of excessive emissions?

p1313 means the misfire is so bad that it is causing cat damge.

I'm bettin gyour Check engine light is blinking. Am I right?

[Pascaltissot]

Sorry, I don’t agree with you guys, it should work perfectly even if there are some differences.. But the only issue you can fin is a lower power.. But not a misfire issue, your problem is surely in your ECU or the step unit sensor...or an air intake somewhere.
I am sure of what I am telling.. You, But of coarse I am not the last word.
Saludos cordiales,
Pascal

[Pascaltissot]

Misfiring Problems


Ignition Leads
Misfiring, with the accompanying rough running, power loss and even stalling, is much less common in the 4.0/4.6 than in the Classic. When it does occur, the prime suspects would be the ignition leads as on any vehicle. Peter Vorwerk of Switzerland had these symptoms on his 1996 4.6SE. After inspecting all the air-intake system and the throttle-position sensor he checked also the camshaft-sensor but didn't find anything strange. Noticing a "clickering" sound, he switched off the light in his garage and could see sparks flying around ignition-lead #2. The solution was a simple replacement with a new lead set. Update 2006: After another two years and 100,000 km, the same symptoms recurred and were cured by another change in leads.
Note: For some reason, 1999-2002 models with the Bosch ignition system are particularly prone to ignition lead failures.

I found this article that might help
Pascal

[Elemental]

I'm thinking he has shit injectors. That would cause a rod to brake as a misfire.

[buick215]

Its Friday night,I've had rather alot to drink but I from what I see of your problem its nothing more than a change of camshaft sprocket needed.The spokes of the sprocket are what the camshaft sensor reads to determine #1 cyl at TDC to enable sequential injection.If you look at the sprokets for Gems and Bosch they are very different.Quite common here in the UK for pre99 motors to get swapped with post 99 - esp as values drop and garages do what they can to keep costs down.
I first worked out what the problem was about 4 yrs ago by scoping the cam and crank sensor together because the car's Motronic ECU continually logged cam sensor faults.It was interesting because the ECU did a good job of trying to make sense of the incorrect readings it was receiving.
Worst thing is the amount of work to change it.

[CTP]

Thanks so much for all of the input. The original engine did not really throw a rod in the normal sence. It looks like the piston disintegrated as all that is left is the collar aound the small end of the rod. The rod is intact. These together slamed thru the cylinder wall. Plugs are uniformly black. All the same. Wires (though cheap auto zone) are brand new.

[CTP]

Here is the beast!