Engine Flush

[Elemental]

Originally Posted by p76rangie

That is very much a generalisation. But you are good at that.

It is not.

I could make the same statement about the 15/40 that you recommend.

No, you could not. In order to meet 15-40, it has to be as least a level II, a Level I simply cannot make it.

10-40 and 20-50 can be acheived with Level I and a much of additives.

That is, it has a very narrow viscosity range and therefore is most likely made with low grade base and certainly crap additives.
I am also not sure why anyone would recommend 0W40 for a Rover V8.

Why would I not Advise Mobil One 0-40 on a Rover? School me.

[p76rangie]

Originally Posted by Elemental

Why brand loyality? Brand isnt going to matter at all, its whats in it.

You just want to make things complicated all the time. I am attempting to give advice what people can use rather than technical stuff that people like yourself want to get all tied up about one measure or substance. For example, this thing you have about supposed damage to cams from certain oils. This has been proven to be "the sky is falling" crap.

With buying a lot of products, we rely on brands. We know that that company generally has good product. For example, some people rave about RTE products. There is no reason for oil to be any different.

Originally Posted by Elemental

My point was a 5-30 of one brand can and does have different chacteristics as 5-30 of another brand. They are both 5-30, but behave completely different.

There are certain standards that the oils have to meet to be able to label their product in certain ways. For example, the viscosity, whether it is a SL or SM oil, etc. So to say that they will behave completely different is a bit of a overstatement. The finer stats will vary between the brands, but the broad stats will stay the same.

Originally Posted by Elemental

What is cheap? More money = Better oil? Not hardly.

Expensive oil will not always guarantee quality, but cheap oil will always guarantee crap. So quality is affected by price.

[p76rangie]

Originally Posted by Elemental

No, you could not. In order to meet 15-40, it has to be as least a level II, a Level I simply cannot make it.

[Elemental]

Ok.... I give... I give...

You just want to fight and have to interest in learning anything.

I give. You win.

So, please exlain to me what makes a high quality oil high quality, and a Low quality oil crap? Both are oil, Both meet SAE spec, both are made from dead dinosaurs....

Tell me what makes a good one good.

[p76rangie]

Originally Posted by Elemental

You just want to fight and have to interest in learning anything.

You have no useable information to teach. All you make are broad statements, call names, or complain about your dick being small.

Originally Posted by Elemental

So, please exlain to me what makes a high quality oil high quality, and a Low quality oil crap? Both are oil, Both meet SAE spec, both are made from dead dinosaurs....

Tell me what makes a good one good.

If people want to know the technicalities, they can read the last argumentative thread on oil. The reality is they just want to know some basic tips that will give them the best chance of buying a have decent oil that will suit them.

So stop trying to start an argument on every point. You are never prepared to provide any real world evidence to support your arguments, yet expect others to.

If you want to get into the real world, get the specs for your Rotella 15W/40 and put them up against the Mobil 1 15W/50 that I have already posted.

[Elemental]

Yeah, dont explain why... Just tell them what to use....

Is that how its done down under?

I explained,repeatly, what I recommend what I do...Also, I made a recomdation on what I would use. Rotella has good Shear Protection. It's cheap. Its avalible everywhere....What more do you want?

I honestly think that someone could fill a Rice Crispies box full of Rat Shit, and you would put in a bowl, fill it with milk and sing snap crackle pop because....The box says they are Rice Crispies, thus they are Rice Crispies.

I call you names, because they fit. You are smart, but too stuborn. It gets in the way of your intellectual growth. I provided plenty of information and evidence...For Free no Less to support what I am telling you. I usually make people pay for the class, you got it for free because I am just a nice guy.


Bottom line, when you know whats in oil, and what the differences are...There are no 'Basic Tips' And, Listen to what you say...."Stop giving that complex information...We cant handle it...Just tell us enough to get by." The people here are pretty smart, they understand information you have a hard time grasping.


And, there is no design flaw that wears out cams. Its a oil flaw!

[brian4d]

Well I get a free oil change because I just had the last star punched in my Texaco card! Buy 5 oil changes get 1 free!! Top That!

Good debate, I might add one thing. Being in a high lvl Page Ranking job I have to comment on the whole brand loyalties thing. Take this statement with a grain of salt; this does not happen with all products, just most off brand products.

Example: Wal-Mart will hire Tide (Proctor and Gamble I believe) to make 100,000 units of Tide Detergent. The catch is Proctor and Gamble must print the classic "Sam’s Choice" Wal-Mart logo on the Tide Product. Wal-mart has leverage because if Proctor and Gamble refuse....... They lose 100,000 units worth of business. I'm not suggesting the same thing happens with oil, I'm just saying it happens a lot. Now this theory differs from other "off Brand theories because of 1 important factor, Proctor and Gamble produced, boxed and shipped their Tide product to Wal-Mart with the Sam’s Choice Logo. You decide.

As with oil, there is always room for a better Brand and quality. That's what drives the price up and down depending on how much time was used to refine the oil. All oil refineries in the U.S. are OLD, built in the 50's and 60's. I'm sure there is research that proves one country refines better oil than another. Find that county, you've found your new brand. If there are oil brands that are refined in other countries and imported into the US expect the prices to be higher.

[Elemental]

http://www.penrite.com.au/files/QDET...%20Greases.pdf

More fun reading, and it comes from down under, so Crocodile Dundee should be happy.

[boca disco]

Ok, well now im all confused. Whats the best suggestion for oil in an 04 in south fla where the temp is usually above 90 degrees.

[Elemental]

My Answer...Based on Specs,price and avaliblity...Rotella t 15-40.

[R_Lefebvre]

Elemental, can you please comment on the Petro Canada Duron products? I'm curious. They look good to me, I'm wondering if better than Rotella?

It was also a very good and important point that the owner's manual was written before the latest oil specifications. I have read that the latest specs have actually reduced wear additives, so it stands to reason that one must be more careful than simply relying on what is in the owner's manual.

I see Rangie has managed to dodge the question why on the one hand he relies so heavily on what is in the owner's manual, but then ignores it anway. It specifically states which oil weight to use, and that it must be A3/B3 rates. Then he goes and uses something heavier, which may lead to poor oil flow, and also recommends products not rated for ACEA A3/B3.

[Elemental]

If you have a rating of A3/B3, thats good.

Anything that has ANY of the following approvals will NOT meet the requirements you need to protect the 1960s Tech, flat tappet lifters engine that Land Rover Used:
ACEA A1/B1, A5/B5, C1, C2 GM 6094M, 4718M ILSAC GF-4

In order to be rated at 15-40, it has to have a min shear of 3.5. Thus, 15-40s would be good.

I was able to open the first link. The other 2 wouldnt open. The Phosphorus % looks good. I cant find a ACEA rating on this sheet however It does meet Cummins 20078

Cummins Engine Oil Recommendations
And Mack E-OM
SwRI: Mack T-8 tests oil filter plugging for soot, viscosity.

And Fords m2c1717d, these 3 ratings include A3 so, I am inclined to think it woudl be ok.

[R_Lefebvre]

Strange that the links are broken now...

[p76rangie]

Originally Posted by Elemental

http://www.penrite.com.au/files/QDET...%20Greases.pdf

More fun reading, and it comes from down under, so Crocodile Dundee should be happy.

Finally you are starting to listen to me. I have often quoted from this document, have referred people to the site in previous threads, and it is the oil that I use personally. It puts the things that you keep on quoting in easy to understand terms and proves many of your points to be incorrect.

The times I have quoted from this document you have accussed me of all sorts of things, now you list it as a good reference. Just proves that you just like to disagree for the sake of it.

[Elemental]

I forgot where I got it from. It was you.
Anyways, I argued your interuptaion of the information.