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Old 08-03-2010, 08:40 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Unhappy Can't Unlock all doors / Indicators not opertational >> Discovery II Td5 ES

Hi Everyone, I am at a loss for ideas with this.. First time it has happened

I have a 1999 Discovery II ES Tdi5. The battery went flat while it was super-locked. I unlocked the driver's door with the key, immobilized the vehicle and alarm with the handset(remote).Charged the battery and then started the engine but the passenger doors and back door won't unlock.

Also the indicators won't operate (plus hazard lights) When the vehicle is armed again the dash board arrow indicators light up but the outside indicators won't work. We checked all fuses. Also tried putting the ignition code in at the driver/s door. I just can't get the other doors to unlock and the indicators to work.

What should I do next?


Notes: The battery has gone flat before, and I have disconnected the batter many times in the past.. this is the first time this has happened.

Please anyone with Ideas?

With thanks

Last edited by Discohawk; 09-26-2010 at 01:49 AM. Reason: New Info leads to Possible BBUS or BCU ..
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:03 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Crazy idea, but disconnect the battery and leave it disconnected for 5 or so minutes; reconnect and see what happens.

Sometimes this will reset electrical / computer issues.. give it a shot and let us know.
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Old 08-04-2010, 04:13 AM   #3 (permalink)
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as i'm new to LR's too, and don't have a manual for mine, i appologize for the stupid question, but... what is "superlock"?

thanks!
hoop
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Old 08-04-2010, 10:39 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman_Engineer View Post
Crazy idea, but disconnect the battery and leave it disconnected for 5 or so minutes; reconnect and see what happens.

Sometimes this will reset electrical / computer issues.. give it a shot and let us know.
Thanks Roman_Engineer,
I thought of that too, and left the batter disconnected overnight. just to make sure.

No luck.

I also read of attempts where , connecting the battery while the key is in the ignition and in position 2.

This too did not work.

In fact, I could not start the engine at all after this.
But after a few tries on the EKA procedure. It seemed to work.

I have also tried the procedure of locking from the driver door, and while in the lock position, pressing the key lock button for a few seconds. And then moving over to the unlock position and doing the same with the unlock key control button.

No luck.

If anything changed now, I get a a beep from the car, in the area of the diesel cap, when i press the internal door /lock/unlock button.
Every second push to the lock side, gives a beep.

If this helps?

Any other ideas?

Thanks for replying. I appreciate it very much.
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Old 08-04-2010, 10:46 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Superlock

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Originally Posted by iambhooper View Post
as i'm new to LR's too, and don't have a manual for mine, i appologize for the stupid question, but... what is "superlock"?

thanks!
hoop
Hi Hoop,

No worries.
Only heard of it in the past.. but now understand a lot more.
Basically , difference between locking from the door, which is regular lock (unless you turn the key to the lock position 4 times , which will put it in super lock.

Superlock = You can not unlock or open the doors from inside when the vehicle is in superlock mode. Much like the BMW's etc..

Regular lock, allow you to manually open a door from inside with or without the unlock/lock button on the front dash. and also does not enable the motion sensors in the vehicle should you wish to leave a pet in the car (With the windows slightly open of course!)

Mine is stuck in superlock , meaning I can't open any of the passenger doors from the inside or with the front lock/unlock button on the dash. :-(

I hope this makes better sense :-)

cheers
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Old 08-04-2010, 03:01 PM   #6 (permalink)
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i think you might have a "miss lock" problem.

exactly how did you open the hood? unlock door with key (car is dead). jump start car, then then use key fob to disarm?
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Old 08-05-2010, 03:59 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Discohawk View Post
Hi Hoop,

No worries.
Only heard of it in the past.. but now understand a lot more.
Basically , difference between locking from the door, which is regular lock (unless you turn the key to the lock position 4 times , which will put it in super lock.

Superlock = You can not unlock or open the doors from inside when the vehicle is in superlock mode. Much like the BMW's etc..

Regular lock, allow you to manually open a door from inside with or without the unlock/lock button on the front dash. and also does not enable the motion sensors in the vehicle should you wish to leave a pet in the car (With the windows slightly open of course!)

Mine is stuck in superlock , meaning I can't open any of the passenger doors from the inside or with the front lock/unlock button on the dash. :-(

I hope this makes better sense :-)

cheers
So if you turn the key to lock (in the door) 4 time's, it sets it so you can't unlock any of the doors? what an evin thing! why would the silly british put that feature in a car?

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Old 08-05-2010, 07:00 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Hi Hoop,

True..
I guess this was the time when BMW owned Land Rover... Guess they wanted to put the extra security in should someone break in through the window, they would not be able to climb out normally... <grin>
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:21 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Miss Lock

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Originally Posted by hafaday View Post
i think you might have a "miss lock" problem.

exactly how did you open the hood? unlock door with key (car is dead). jump start car, then then use key fob to disarm?
Hi Hafaday,

Miss lock?
This is a first I hear of this. Is it possible to correct from my position here?

Ok, this is the series of events as best as I can remember:

1) Doors would not open with key pressed,
2) Driver door open. key in the starter and tried to start
3) Nothing happened.. Battery was dead.
4) Left like this until I could get a charger on it.
5) Then connected a charger on batter..
6) Alarm went off immediately ... Driver door and hood were open.
7) Then pressed unlock on of the button
8) Alarm stopped..
9) Then charged the battery.

And now in current situation.

Thanks for getting back to me.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Discohawk View Post
Hi Hafaday,

Miss lock?
This is a first I hear of this. Is it possible to correct from my position here?

Ok, this is the series of events as best as I can remember:

1) Doors would not open with key pressed,
2) Driver door open. key in the starter and tried to start
3) Nothing happened.. Battery was dead.
4) Left like this until I could get a charger on it.
5) Then connected a charger on batter..
6) Alarm went off immediately ... Driver door and hood were open.
7) Then pressed unlock on of the button
8) Alarm stopped..
9) Then charged the battery.

And now in current situation.

Thanks for getting back to me.
you have just described the "miss lock". the car was locked and armed one way, but came back to life and the BCU found it self in a different way. i'll do a lot of cut and pasting on this when i get home and have the time to do so. look later today for a possible solution.

not guaranteeing a fix though.
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Old 08-05-2010, 04:02 PM   #11 (permalink)
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all quotes from the shop manual...

"NOTE: Disconnecting the battery while the alarm is armed triggers the alarm. Always disarm the alarm system before disconnecting the battery."


to late for that..

"The BCU uses the door latch switches to indicate if a door is open or closed. There is a door latch switch within every door latch assembly, including the tail door latch assembly."

"The driver's door lock actuator has a dedicated 12 volts power supply from the passenger compartment fuse box to energise the locking action of the door lock actuator. The passenger and rear door lock actuators share a 12 volts power supply from the passenger compartment fuse box to energise the locking action of the door lock actuator.
To perform the super locking action all the door lock actuators receive a 12 volts power supply from the passenger compartment fuse box.
To perform the unlocking action for all the doors, a 12 volts power supply from the passenger compartment fuse box is supplied to the door lock actuators."


"The BCU uses a plunger type switch to determine if the bonnet has been forcibly opened when the alarm has been set. The switch is located under the bonnet on the left hand side of the vehicle when viewed from the rear."

"Handset and receiver
The handset is incorporated in the key. It uses coded radio frequency signals to lock, unlock and super lock the vehicle remotely with a range of up to 10 metres (33 ft). The handset also mobilises the vehicle by transmitting a
remobilisation signal when the handset is within range of the passive remobilisation exciter coil."

"The BCU supplies the receiver with a 12 volts power supply. On receiving a valid signal from the handset, the receiver transmits a 1000 baud signal to the BCU to allow locking/unlocking of the vehicle."

more reading.

"The BBUS is located behind the rear quarter trim panel on the right hand side of the vehicle and is utilised as an additional alarm warning device. It has a self contained power source allowing it to operate when the vehicle battery
is disconnected.
NOTE: Always disarm the BBUS before carrying out any procedures related to the BBUS."

"Input/Output
The BBUS utilises a 12 volts power supply from fuse 20 (15 amperes) located in the passenger compartment fusebox via a relay to charge the self contained battery.
When the alarm is triggered, the BCU is pulled high internally triggering the BBUS to sound continuously for 30 seconds.
The BCU sets the BBUS to its internal battery backed mode when the vehicle battery is disconnected. If a mislock occurs the BCU triggers the BBUS for a period of 50 ms. The BCU triggers the BBUS once for a period of 50 ms when an EKA code is requested. When the EKA code is entered correctly, the BBUS will operate twice for a period of 50 ms on, 200 ms off. The BBUS utilises a dedicated earth path."


the BBUS is located in the rear cargo area. that is probably what you hear beeping. it is behind the trim panel, under the side window, but above the wheel well (passenger side if it's a NAS version)

what do you have flashing?


"A Light Emitting Diode (LED) situated in the instrument cluster indicates the condition of the anti-theft system and acts as a warning to potential thieves that the alarm system is activated.
Input/Output
The LED has a dedicated signal from the BCU to indicate the status of the following:

l Alarm armed: The LED flashes at 10 Hz with a 50:50 duty cycle for 10 seconds, after which the LED flashes 50 ms on, 2 seconds off until the state of the system changes.

l Engine immobilised: If the engine is immobilised and the ignition is on, the LED is illuminated continuously. If the engine is immobilised and the ignition is off, the LED flashes 50 ms on, 2 seconds off.

l Alarm tampered: If the alarm has been triggered, the LED flashes at 10 Hz with a 50:50 duty cycle.

l Handset battery low indicator: If the handset battery is low, the driver's door is open and the ignition is switched off, the LED flashes two pulses of 50 ms on, 50 ms off, every 10 seconds."


i can go on and on and on with this. you said the EKA gave you access and lets you start the engine, correct?

now, after all that reading you will hate my answer. because i'm piss'n in the wind on this one......... try shutting all doors and hood, lock the vehicle with either the remote or key itself (in door). wait a few minuets and then unlock the same way you locked it. it might work or might not.

oh yeah, from all the reading i did on this thing. the SUPERLOCK feature sucks. also it can be deactivated by the dealer. and there are a shit load options or configurations that can be programed for the alarm, and locking of doors. again, all done by the dealer.

i tried to help, but it probably won't work.

~Bill
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Old 08-06-2010, 09:36 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Discohawk, I am having a similar problem. Lost my key fob and I need to disengage the alarm to turn on the vehicle. How did you input the eka code. # of times in what direction??? Need help.
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Old 08-06-2010, 09:47 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Discohawk, I am having a similar problem. Lost my key fob and I need to disengage the alarm to turn on the vehicle. How did you input the eka code. # of times in what direction??? Need help.
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Old 09-26-2010, 01:47 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default EKA entry procedure

Hi hotrodrigo,

Here is the procedure. Apologies for for the late reply. I have been away for some time now.

I hope this helps

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Emergency key accessThe code is recorded on the security information card and is entered as follows:

1. Using the key, turn the driver's door lock to the UNLOCK position and hold in this position for at least 5 seconds. An audible warning is then emitted to indicate that the body control unit is ready to accept the code. Return the key to the centre position. It is now possible to use the key to enter the separate numerical values of the four digits that make up the EKA code.
2. Enter the first digit of the code. If the first digit is 4, turn the key to the UNLOCK position 4 times. Ensure the key is fully returned to the centre position after each turn of the key.
3. Enter the second digit of the code. If the second digit is 3, turn the key to the LOCK position 3 times. Ensure the key is fully returned to the centre position after each turn of the key.
4. Enter the third digit of the code. If the third digit is 2, turn the key to the UNLOCK position twice. Ensure the key is fully returned to the centre position after each turn of the key.
5. Enter the fourth digit of the code. If the fourth digit is 1, turn the key to the LOCK position once. Ensure the key is fully returned to the centre position after each turn of the key.
6. Finally, turn the key to the UNLOCK position and back to the centre position, a double bleep will indicate that the code has been entered correctly. A single bleep indicates that the code has been entered incorrectly.Then, before opening the door, wait 5 minutes for the alarm and immobiliser to be de-activated. During the 5 minute wait for the alarm and immobiliser to be de-activated, the alarm indicator LED in the instrument pack continues to flash (one flash every 2 seconds). DO NOT OPEN THE DOOR OR ATTEMPT TO ENTER THE CAR until the full delay period has elapsed.When the 5 minute wait has elapsed, the alarm indicator LED stops flashing. Immediately open the door, insert the key in the ignition switch and turn the switch to position II. If the ignition switch is not turned to position II within 30 seconds of the end of the 5 minute wait, the engine is automatically immobilised again.
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Old 09-26-2010, 01:59 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Progress with New Questions

Hi Everyone,

I have managed to get hold of a Hawkeye to diagnose the problem further.

Interesting points to note:

Can't force unlock of doors from the Hawkeye either.

I have attached a diagram from Land Rover Workshop Manual as reference.
Seems like it could be the BBUS , since it is between the BCU and the following:

BCU(1) >> BBUS(13) - which then controls the following:

* (14) Alarm Sounder - Which when goes off now-- does not make the usual alarm sound, but rather a mono toned continuous sound
* (15) Vehicle Horns - Working
* (16) Directional Indicators (Not working)
* (17) Door Lock actuators (Not working)
* (18) ECM : When I disconnect the battery. I struggle to get the engine started : EKA code have never worked. I get it working via Door key and pushing the lock button and turning the key at the same time to the lock position, and visa verse with unlock. Waiting 10 minutes. Then can start the engine.


I am also attaching information I extracted with the HawkEye today:

Land Rover Discovery 2 ES: Td5



Model : 1999
BCU: Software level : 07.01
Live Data:


1. CDL Lock

Working
2. Driver Door Switch

Working
3. Park Neutral Sw.

N/A
4. CDL Unlock


Working
5. Pass Door Switch

Closed
6. Inertia Switch


Triggered
7. Key Lock


Idle
8. Bonnet Switch

Closed
9. Key Unlock


Idle
10. Ign Key Insert


IN
11. LLH Window UP Sw.

Idle
12. LLH Window Down Sw
Idle

13. FRH Window UP Sw.

Idle
14. FRH Window Down Sw.
Idle

15. Front Washer Switch

Off
16. Tail Wiper Sw.

Off
17. FR Interm Wipe Sw.

Off
18. Tail Wash Sw

Off
19. FR Wipe Park sense

Off
20. Reverse gear sw

Not selected
21. Front Wipe speed

Speed 5
22. LH Indicator Switch

Off (working)
23. Front Fog Switch

Working
24. Dipped Beam sw

Off
25. RH Indicator Sw

Off (Won't change)!!!!!!
26. Tail Fog Switch

Off
27. Main Beam sw

Off
28. Hazard switch


off Working
29. Side Light Switch

off
30. DRL Active


On
31. Ignition 2


On
32. Heated Rr Window

Off
33. Heated Fr Window

Off
34. Driver Door Sw

Open


Circuit Tests:

1. Horn

Working
2. Fuel Flap

Not Working: But works when Hawkeye is dosconnected
3. Alarm Led


Working
4. Ign Interlock :N/A


5. Crank Enable

Not Working
6. Lock Doors

Not Working
7. Unlock Doors

Not Working
8. Superlock Doors
Not Working

9. Single point of entry
Not Working

10. Front LH Window

Working
11. Front RH Window

Working
12. Rr Window Enable
??

13. Sunroof Enable
??

14. Front Wipe Enable
??

15. Rear Wipe Enable
??

16. H/Lamp Power Wash

Working
17. Front Fogs Relay

Working
18. LH Indicator Enable
Not Working

19. RH Indicator Enable
Not Working

20. Shift Interlock

??
21. Transfer Neutral
??

22. Sounder


Working
23. Check Engine Lamp

Working
24. LH Indicator Warn Lamp
Working

25. RH Indicator Warn Lamp
Working

26. Check ACE Lamp

Working
27. Manual Lamp

Not Working
28. Diff Lock Lamp

Working
29. Oil Pressure Lamp

Working
30. H/Temp warn Lamp

Working
31. Sport Warn Lamp
??

32. Trans Temp Lamp

Working
33. Alternator W/Lamp

Working
34. Trailer Indicator Lamp
Working

35. HDC Selec w/lamp

Working
36. ABS Warn Lamp

Working
37. Traction W.lamp

Working
38. Check HDC W/lamp

Working
39. Brake Warn Lamp

Working
40. Seat belt W/lamp

Working
41. Glow Plug w/lamp

Working
42. Check SLS W/lamp

Working
43. Heated rear window

Working
44. Heated rear window lamp
Working

45. Heated front lamp

Working



Programming:


18 Superlock:

Double Plip or double key urn
20 Alam Disarm:

Always disarm with key
24 Alarm:

Alarm
25 Passive:

Passive Immobilisation
27 Misslock:

Misslock
28 Alarm Sound:

BBS Only
33 EKA

EKA


So my question is: :-)

Ever seen of heard of such a problem?

Would you agree it is the BBUS?
Or is it a BCU replacement issue?
Or is it a IDM issue? The three are connected to one another one way or another...

P.S I have checked all he fuses.
I have even disconnected the Inertia switch while the engine was running to simulate a collision. The engine cut out as expected, but the auto open of the doors and hazards did not happen.
Something is seriously not good here.

Any ideas would be appreciated.
Attached Thumbnails
Stuck in Superlock >> Discovery II Td5 ES-bcu_diagram.jpg  
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