Serious Tire Question....

[Badger1]

Originally Posted by Hank

Can you fit 35's ona stock Heep?

Yes...

[lutz]

iv had them on my one of my hummers and i had side wall cracking to the point of leaking.but i left them down to 10psi all the time.

[300bhp/ton]

Originally Posted by Badger1

Yes...

I'm no expert on Jeeps, but I did a fair amount of research on YJ's early in the year as I was considering buying one. And I doubt 35"s would fit stock without rubbing, and certainly not off roading.

Even with a 4.5" lift I was being told that 35" would still be restrictive and 33"s would be a better bet. An SOA conversoin looked idea for running 35"s.

But hay I could be wrong.

[SCSL]

Originally Posted by 300bhp/ton

I'm no expert on Jeeps, but I did a fair amount of research on YJ's early in the year as I was considering buying one.

The horror !!

[Badger1]

Originally Posted by 300bhp/ton

I'm no expert on Jeeps, but I did a fair amount of research on YJ's early in the year as I was considering buying one. And I doubt 35"s would fit stock without rubbing, and certainly not off roading.

Even with a 4.5" lift I was being told that 35" would still be restrictive and 33"s would be a better bet. An SOA conversoin looked idea for running 35"s.

But hay I could be wrong.

The 33 would be the better choice. I actually was just being a smartass when it came to the 35s. A buddy of mine had 35 inch tires he shoehorned onto a 78 Jeep drove it around for a couple weeks before we finally got around to lifting it for a trip up to the Pipeline in northern Wisconsin(close to where I used to live, awesome trail). He just did it for giggles and shits I guess. Would never work like that stock for wheeling though.

[300bhp/ton]

Originally Posted by SCSL

The horror !!

lol

But seriously I know there's a bit of rivalry but I do like the Jeeps, and they are quite capable. Plus rather rare here in the UK where as Land Rovers are very common. I'd still like to get a YJ and lift it and run 35"s just for something different, but I'd still keep my Discovery for competition work though.

But hay don't worry, I'm not deserting LR, on the country between myself, my borhter and my parents we have had quite a few LR's over the years:

-Series 2 88" 2.25
-Series 2a Diesel
-110 V County
-Range Rover (classic) 2.5 TD (VM diesel)
-Range Rover 3.9 Vogue SE
-Range Rover 4.6 HSE x 2
-Discovery 3.9 V8
-Series 3 truck cab 2.25
-Defender 90 300TDi
-Discovery 5 door 200TDi
-Range Rover 3.5 V8 carb
-Range Rover 3.9 EFI Vogue
-Range Rover 3.5 EFI
-Series 3 Lightweight 2.25
-90 V8 full tilt
-Discovey 3 door 200TDi

I may have missed a couple.

[Bwana]

Originally Posted by llesra

those are the radial version of the baja claw

Click on his link. They are belted bias ply. There's no "R" in the size. Like 285/75R/16. "R" for radial.

[p76rangie]

To go back to the original question about the amount of rubber on the side wall. As my road tyres I run 255/85/16 tyres. This means that the amount of rubber extending from the rim is 85% of 255mm or 217mm. The 325/65 tyres would have 65% of 325mm or 211mm of rubber. This should be more than adequate for off roading.

In regard to bigger tyres breaking axles, it's all bullshit. Running bigger tyres places no more strain on the drive train than towing a trailer or filler up the car with people. Ran standard axles with 33 inch rubber for years with front and rear lockers. As others have said, it is the driver. That is, it are the people that want to play hard that get bigger tyres. The bigger tyres allow them to get into situations that standard tyres will not go. Playing hard and adverse situations will break things.

I had to upgrade the rear axles when I went to 4.11 diffs. The higher ratio diffs allows the drivetrain to put more leverage onto the axles. This extra stress will break axles. I have never broken a CV. For those that might think that I do not do "real" offroading, think again. The Rangie is only used for offroading and is not a daily driver.

Ian

[LR Max]

Originally Posted by 300bhp/ton

40" tyre, are you serious. Unless that Jeep is super modded 33" seem to be the ultimate size for articulation but that still requires a lift, and 35" with limited travel unless the Jeep has about 2 feet of lift on it.

I've seen 37" swampers, but you can count axle articulation as zero.

A lot of jeeps around here are super modified. Most of my friends run super modified jeeps. Three of them run coilovers and 4 link suspensions. But that isn't the relevant topic. Built Jeeps are common in the United States and unlike land rovers, Jeep suspensions do not rely on suspension uptravel, but more suspension downtravel. Uptravel can sometimes invoke a roll over. And yes. 40" tires and EVEN BIGGER. Of course all vehicles with such huge tires have trimmed fenders, etc.

But none of that is relevant to the discussion. With such huge vehicles, compensating for heavy ass tires with lightweight rims is a great idea. Expecially when each tire carcass weighs 90 lbs. Shaving 20 lbs off of each corner can REALLY make a difference in performance, even in day to day driving.

So, bottom line: lighter is better.

[Hank]

Originally Posted by p76rangie

In regard to bigger tyres breaking axles, it's all bullshit. Running bigger tyres places no more strain on the drive train than towing a trailer or filler up the car with people. Ran standard axles with 33 inch rubber for years with front and rear lockers. As others have said, it is the driver. That is, it are the people that want to play hard that get bigger tyres. The bigger tyres allow them to get into situations that standard tyres will not go. Playing hard and adverse situations will break things.


Ian

That's probably the most retarded, false statement I've ever read.

[KevinNY]

Bigger tire=Bigger lever, more stress. Same as your 4.11s from the other end

BUT, I agree knowing when and how to use the throttle will let you get away with bigger tires while others are blowing diffs and axles.

[p76rangie]

Hank, it appears that you justify you breaking things on your tyres. A poor tradesman always blames his tools. You may wish to explain further how bigger tyres add any more stress to the axles than say driving up a hill. You have the same motor and power. You have the same gearing to the wheels. It is just that the wheels are harder to turn due to the extra distance the cover with one revolution. Going up a hill makes the tyres harder to turn because it is trying to push the vehicle up the hill. Put bigger tyres on and you will find your acceleration and performance gets shot to hell because of this change in gearing. A range rover is capable of pulling 4 tonne, this is a lot more load than the bigger tyres.

As said previously, I ran 33 inch tyres with front and rear lockers for years without breaking a thing. Even when I went to 4.11's I only had to upgrade the rear axles. The fronts remained standard and did not break. But then again I do not drive like an idiot. If you do, something will always break. As you and others have pointed out, if you upgrade axles you will start breaking CV's. No 4WD is unbreakable. But what do I know I am retarded.

Ian

[SCSL]

Originally Posted by p76rangie

In regard to bigger tyres breaking axles, it's all bullshit. Running bigger tyres places no more strain on the drive train than towing a trailer or filler up the car with people.

I don't even know how to respond to this statement...

Ran standard axles with 33 inch rubber for years with front and rear lockers. As others have said, it is the driver.

OK, that would explain it. I'm not sure 33" tires would be considered "big" in the US.

It is common knowledge that running larger tires (35"+) places greater stress on drivetrain parts including axles & CVs, especially with lockers. Commonly available axles are even rated for various size tires. Who runs 35's on a locked up Defender with stock axles? Nobody who wheels... Who runs 35's on Dana 30's ?

If what you assert is in fact true, why do wheelers even bother to upgrade their axles?? Why is the Dana 60 the WEAKEST axle of the 10 trucks lined up for Four Wheeler's Top Truck Challenge? (it progresses up from there to Dana 70's, 2.5 ton Rockwells, and 5 ton Rockwells). Why don't pro rockcrawlers run stock axles? Why don't OBC participants, for that matter, retain their stock axles?

Oh yeah... they all must be bad drivers.....

[Hank]

Bigger tires leave a bigger footprint. Plain and simple. More traction, more stress, more foot-pounds, more broken axles. Not even mentioning it's a larger rotating force, or heavier tire.

If you ran a 33" tire and lockers, you must be sticking to the pussy trails. The stock rear axles are JUNK. The torque limits of a stock LR axle is weak. Damn things are made of pot metal.

[p76rangie]

SCSL, you are now bringing a whole lot of other factors as to why people upgrade axles. This discussion was about whether bigger tyres cause axles to break. Quotes earlier by people were saying that if you run 33 inch or bigger you need to upgrade axles. I actually now run close to 35 inch tyres and still no issue. I would be very surprised if people were running 37 inch or greater tyres with standard motors and gearing. Therefore they would have change diff ratios and put a lot more power up front. I stated earlier than changing gearing will break the axles.

The competition trucks upgrade their axles because they put their trucks through hell. They would break standard axles whether they were running 30 inch or 40 inch tyres. So again, it is not the tyres on their own that justify the axle upgrades.

I see people with near stock size tyres blowing up diffs, breaking axles and CVs on a regular basis. Then I see people with large tyres and standard CVs not break a thing. I now run Maxi-drive axles front and rear. Overall they cost around $1,500 plus fitting. As I have previously stated, I upgraded the rear due to the 4.11's. I did break a front axle due to driver error. Front axles are a pain in the arse to change. CVs and drive flanges are a lot easier to replace. So I upgraded the front axles so that any future breakages in the drive-train would be easier to fix in the bush.

So there are a lot of reasons to upgrade axles, but simply putting on bigger tyres is not one of them.

Something else to think about. What is the actual diametre of a 37 inch tyre on 15 inch rims running 10 PSI pressure. Heres a hint, it is nowhere near 37 inches. So why is it going to break an axle more than running smaller tyres with a bit more pressure in them.