rusty 109 outriggers

[jkhackney]

I'm looking at buying a very nice 109 station (1975) with rust on the outriggers (rear, front of spring). I would replace one of them which has a large surface split (flake) about 4" long (don't know what's under it, afraid to poke it). On the other, the drain hole is no longer round, indicating loss of steel right above the spring. This might not need immediate replacement. The rest of the car has no rust.

1) Does a rusty outrigger indicate anything about the rest of the chassis? I will carefully hammer it all today and take pictures.
2) If I get the outriggers replaced at a non-Landy shop, should I give them replacement spring bushings and spring bolts, as well, in case they need to damage these to get the spring off?
3) Any other parts I should provide them with that they might break during the repair (retaining strap, etc.)?
Thanks,
Jeremy

[pickuprover]

Rusty outriggers is normal... however it can indicate a rusty frame.... also make sure you check the bulkhead (bottom of door posts, under windscreen, around vent flaps... etc..)
I rebuilt the srping hangers around the old bushings... I jacked the truck up so the hangers were not under any load (force of shock eliminating force of truck on spring..) then carefully cut and replaced each piece leaving the two tabs with the bushings in place... was trick, but easier than replacing bushings that were known to be good.

[TerryS]

If it's just the outriggers you're concerned with, you don't even touch the springs, bolts or bushings. They mount through the frame and not to the outriggers. However, Land Rover frames rot from the inside out. This is the best excuse for Waxoyl or other preservative treatments. You can't really tell what's going on until it's too late. If you need to do frame patching in the spring bushing areas, you can put fishplates on the frame sides, with a hole such that the hole fits right over the bushing.
The front horns are known to go and that's where the front of the front springs mount. There are replacement horn sections available also.
Replacing an individual outrigger is quite easy. Oddly, the easiest one to replace is the bulkhead outrigger. Remove the bolt, cut the outrigger off and grind it smooth to the frame. Then bolt the new outrigger in, before welding. This locates it positively, then weld.

[jkhackney]

This is the thing I'm worried about (pic from another vehicle, the one I'm looking at isn't so bad):


No other visible rust. Still, I whacked the frame all 'round with the pointy end of a screwdriver like Norman in the movie "psycho" and only these parts (I thought they were outriggers) "thunked". Everything else "pings" nicely.

This surplus fire dept truck has only 11k miles but 32 years of sitting around in a heated garage. Aside from this, the other weaknesses I found are pitted (not rusty) chrome balls, hole in the muffler, and 8-yr old tires ... asking price 7000 SFr or about £2800/$5800 US (probably topics for a different thread).
-Jeremy

[TerryS]

My mistake. You are refering to the spring perches. They need to be located from the dimensions shown for the chassis is the manual. There are differences between SW, 3 door & Military One Ton.
I've never replace a rear spring perch, because, generally, the reat of the frame is so far gone at that point.
Rear crossmembers, front horns and body outriggers go faster than the general frame, so they get changed more frequently.
Once a hole opens up in a box section perch or outrigger (despite the ends being open), decay is much more rapid, as debris gets in there and retains moisture.
Whether it's a Landy shop or independant isn't as important as whether they are specialists in frame welding and repair.

[jkhackney]

Sorry about mixing up terms, it's different in different catalogs and I didn't find it in the Green Bible under chassis. Maybe it's under suspension (I need a Haynes). I don't know why the SIII is only rotted in the perches. The mudflaps possibly protected the rear crossmember ... The SIIA in the picture had a rotten rear chassis, which is why I passed on it (a whole bunch of people had bid on it online without looking at it first, though!).

@Andrew, thanks, I'll pass it along to my shop.