VC's, CDL's, and some locker stuff too!

[nfrey2]

I know this subject seems to have been worn out but I can't find a definative answer to my questions.

Can a manual locking diff be installed in a BW Tcase, or do i need to find an LT230? Whats the way to go about this it was mentioned this was cheaper than lockers?

In a coupla of other posts it was made mention of the preference of having a cdl over buying lockers or LSD's becuase with a VC lockers could not be utilized fully. How so?

A rover buddy mentioned to me that beween 1500-1800 RPM is the speed at which the VC "locks" this doesn't make sense as I thought the VC was wheel speed dependent. Is there any base to this?

My understanding is that RRC have 10-spline axle and discos have the 24 spline a stronger axle. Are they interchangeable providing you change the carrier, in which case a locker would be installed?

[Nomar]

LT230 isnt going to make any difference over a BW except for selectability. YOU lock up the LT, the BW locks itself when needed.

I had F & R ARB lockers in my RR with the BW; full traction.
Later, got an LT230 ;still full traction but selectable. My BW was still working when pulled.

Manual CDL cant be put in BW.

General consensus is that 24 spline axles arent any stronger than 10's, just as well upgrade to HD 24 spline stuff unless you're gonna change out the Rover drivetrain completely.

I got 3rd members from a D-90 for my 91 RR and changed over to 24 spl stuff

[sven]

My choice was more $$ reasons. I needed a new VC which costs around $800. A used LT230 with all the linkages, front driveshaft, etc costed me under $500.

[Disco Mike]

I would run the LT230 so that I could have full 4wheel ability at lower RPM's when I needed it, plus you wouldn't have to worry about burning the VC again.
Mike

[nfrey2]

awesome appreciate the info guys

[drg]

If you're going to be building a REAL rock crawler, i.e., frequent the kind of trails where you need a spotter to avoid slipping off a rock and bashing in a body panel or rolling, then the zero-speed positive locking of the LT230 is probably useful.

On the other hand, the BW VC works very well. It is non-linear: that is, it doesn't come in at a specific RPM. If you get significant front/rear differential action (i.e., one axle is spinning and the other has traction), the slipping causes the oil to change viscosity and 'glue' the front and rear axles together for a short period of time, regardless of RPM. It's not as crude as a clutch-based limited-slip diff, where you have to add more tire spin to transfer more torque. Once activated, it will continue to keep the front and rear 'nearly' locked, even at much lower differential speeds.

It's like a ball of cotton. Pull lightly, and it comes apart easily. Pull fast, and it binds up and holds tight. Release pressure completely and then pull lightly again, and it comes free. That's kind of analogous to how the VC works.

When I go out in my stock '95 RRC with 245/75 mud tires, I never lack for traction. I've been on dirt slopes that had reasonable traction but were too steep to climb. All of the weight transfers to the rear. A Disco with CDL open would spin the front wheels. Even at low speed (barely turning), all 4 wheels spun on my rig, as if I had a positively locked diff. And no, my VC hasn't failed locked up... it still turns tight circles smoothly.

In general, on reasonably tough trails I always just air down to 12PSI. I've been through some gnarly climbs without any wheel slip, when other rigs had to fight their way up. The quality of your tires and the care in your driving is more important than BW vs LT230. Easy on the skinny pedal. Have just enough momentum, but don't 'rod it' over the obstacles.

The only real problem with the BW is that the VC does wear out. The TC itself probably lasts as long as an LT230, but the VC won't last the life of the TC. Figure 75-100k miles. It's not particularly weak, but it's one more thing that eventually breaks and it's not cheap.

The 10-spline vs. 24-spline axles is year-based, not model-based. Some time in mid-93 production (I think), they switched to 24-spline. My RRC has 24-spline axles.

I disagree that there is a consensus that 10-spline axles are just as strong. In fact, I've rarely heard that claim. It may be true that stock 10-spline and stock 24-spline axles are both significantly weaker than a good 24-spline HD axle, but a stock 24-spline axle is still stronger than a stock 10-spline axle.

To switch from 10-spline to 24-spline axles, you need to change diff carriers (more likely, use an aftermarket traction diff). However, you probably also need new CV joints in the front axles, as they are different. Aftermarket axles may permit you to use a 24-spline diff with the older-style CVs (which are a bit stronger than the later CVs used with stock 24-spline axles... getting confused?)

On the other hand, financially it doesn't make sense to stop at stock 24-spline axles if you are going to upgrade. Just go all the way to aftermarket HD axles.

One final consideration: you will break fewer axles and CV joints with the BW than with the LT230. If you are trying to decide between swapping in an LT230 in, OR upgrade the axles, and you're going to be taking trails where you really need the CDL, I'd definitely suggest upgrading to HD axles first, or you probably will break a stock axle.

And if you don't already have traction diffs, you'll notice little or no difference in your truck's capabilities between the BW and the LT230.

[gordo]

hey Man, I see your nearby. Check out the FLRC website on my sig. We got a rally coming up real soon. Anyway, in FL we see mostly mud and in all honestly the BW is great in the mud. Ive felt mine engaged/disengage and pull me through some tough stuff. Now it isnt nearly as strong. If the VC doesnt break itself the Chain will stretch. (been there done that!) The LT230 is gear driven and much more reliable. That being said you might as well wheel it til it breaks. Plus the BW can be had CHEAP! As far as axles go, the 10 splines will surprise you. they arent as strong as the 24 spline ( 10 spline are 1.1 inches and 24 spline are 1.24) but Ive never broke one in 6 yrs of offroading (a CV yes and mud is very forgiving and I dont torture it). I would leave it alone for now and spend money on other upgrades myself. Ive ran stock 10 spline axles with 255/85 for 3 years or so. Gordo

[gordo]

one more thing not all RRCs are 10 spline. they went to 24 spline Mid 93. I cant tell what year yours is from the small photo. Gordo