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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-06-2008, 09:43 PM Thread Starter
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hand crankable starting

I am a newbe on rovers familiar with all rootes group vehicles. am looking at getting a series 109 landrover but have some questions

are these or certian years start able by use of a hand crank gas and desiel models (thanks aswered a few post down -best tool ever)
used to crank a series 2 alpine al the time had fun once in sandeiago light district a lot of people were looking at it when i went into a store on coming out when i reached behind the seat and came out with the handle every one was runnning thought i was going to go balistic on them the police that responded seeing me whith the handle just gapped as i used it to start the sunbeam.

what years are as on ebay i have seen what looks like a hand crank hole in front bumper

please am also wondering what average fuel milage is for these vehicles

wanting a vehicle that goes when i want no matter what. !!!!!!!!

thank you

bill
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-06-2008, 10:42 PM
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all the "series rovers" have the crank hole, i believe.
'48-'83 I think.

From what i've read and my experience in the last few weeks of owning would indicate that it is not a vehicle that goes when you want to no matter what.
It seems to be more designed to be repaired frequently with relative ease than be reliable. Though I have to say; mine (and others I've heard of) does pop over every time it passes a compression stroke.

I can't imagine trying to crank over a diesel without some sort of gear reduction box. I believe the 2.25 diesel is 22 or 23:1.. vs 7 or 8:1 in the petrol. But I may be wrong.


I have not been able to get the thing running long enough to calculate mileage. I found somewhere where someone said 17mpg in good tune. I believe it was the petrol version. I could believe it. But if someone told me 30 or 8 I would believe that as well.
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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-06-2008, 11:56 PM Thread Starter
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depends on the owner

all british vehicles are tempermental it just takes a gental patiant person with all the understandings of british temperment. AS I WAS TOLD WHEN I PURCHASED MY FIRST BRITISH CAR a 1960 sunbeam alpine in 1975 it took me from then untill 1987 23 alpines later to get there i allways had the pationt the rest was learned!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

first thing learned all british cars leak oil if it don't its out of it. had one alpine after complete overhaul no leakage for 60 days went on trip and then ran out of oil on the road.

second thing have right tools learned about british witworth.

third allways carry spare parts. after a while you get to know which ones.

forth allways talk to them (NICE LY)

but most of all ya got to understand british engineering and humor.

with the above you can almost never have to walk

thats my expereince with roots group vehicles

im ready to try land rover i don't want any electronics if i can help it no power thinges

I am the person who drove a 1930 model AA FORD 2 ton truck all original all around san francisco bay area1985-1991 regularly was stationed at NAVAL STATION TREASURE ISLAND 1985 to 1991 it went across bay bridge regulary at aprox 25 mph on any uphill grade.

so welcome me to your ranks
bill
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-07-2008, 03:53 PM
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I have started my 1968 Series IIA 109 2.6L a few times with the crank. It is a breeze if it has been started already that day. I have started it cold, just to see what it was like, and it was not bad. I think on the second or third crank. I have yet to be able to get the crank to line up without looking under the vehicle. I wish I could figure out how to line it up by feel. That may come with time.
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-07-2008, 09:25 PM Thread Starter
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cranking

it takes some time before you can just shove it in and crank with out looking

and REMEMBER ALWAYS PULL UP NEVER PUSH DOWN AND DONT WRAPE YOUR THUMB AND FINGERS JUST CUP IT. AS A KID SAW A GUY ON A MODEL A PUSH DOWN IT AKTUALLY FOLDED HIS ARM BROKE IN QUIT A FEW AREA'S.

In the 1980's had a 1930 ford AA truck started it 6 volt/12 volt/hand crank funny thing it allways stated easier by hand crank.

allways ignition off choke if temp required turn with crank twice
ignition on pull up once 98% of the time it always started.

did same with alpine

AND REMEMBER ALWAYS PULL

bill
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-08-2008, 08:30 AM
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Thanks for the tips on "technique". I will be sure to remember them.
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-08-2008, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giorgio View Post
I wish I could figure out how to line it up by feel. That may come with time.
You can do one of two things:

Get the cone that was used on MOD trucks. It bolts between crank bolt and front pulley. If the crank is ANYWHERE near the center of the large hole in the front crossmember, the cone guides the crank right into place.

Second thing is what I did first (Before I found out about the cone).
Since I had to hank one of mine (that's short for hand-crank) everyday in winter for 7 years, I took a piece of 1/4"x2" flat stock about 6" long, drilled a 3/4" hole in the center, milled two slots for the crank dogs, and bolted it to my front crossmember, so that the crank was aligned with the hole in the bumper, and crank dog.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-08-2008, 11:47 AM
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Crank guide cone

When I climbed underneath to take this pic so you'd see what I meant, I found I have a different type of crank cone than I have had on other trucks. Nonetheless, you get the idea.
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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-08-2008, 05:44 PM
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Terry,

Thanks for the additional information. Hopefully, I will only need the crank for "novelty" purposes, but it would be nice to make the process seem a little more seamless.
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-12-2008, 01:22 PM
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i posted a similar

Quote:
Originally Posted by giorgio View Post
Terry,

Thanks for the additional information. Hopefully, I will only need the crank for "novelty" purposes, but it would be nice to make the process seem a little more seamless.
i posted a similar topic "best tool ever onthe series area. pretty fun replys. first time i used it on my 78 series i had a wicked good laugh. it was just so darn funny to see that thing start up like that. tom

"Life is tough! Life is tougher when you're stupid!" -John Wayne
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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 10:32 PM
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by turretman1st View Post
it takes some time before you can just shove it in and crank with out looking

and REMEMBER ALWAYS PULL UP NEVER PUSH DOWN AND DONT WRAPE YOUR THUMB AND FINGERS JUST CUP IT. AS A KID SAW A GUY ON A MODEL A PUSH DOWN IT AKTUALLY FOLDED HIS ARM BROKE IN QUIT A FEW AREA'S.

In the 1980's had a 1930 ford AA truck started it 6 volt/12 volt/hand crank funny thing it allways stated easier by hand crank.

allways ignition off choke if temp required turn with crank twice
ignition on pull up once 98% of the time it always started.

did same with alpine

AND REMEMBER ALWAYS PULL

bill
Sorry, but I have to say BULLSHIT. I started my '67 type IIa for two winters in Jackson WY, often in subzero temps, and you will break your arm trying to pull up on it. Mine always started in about a 1/4 turn - I'd just get it on compression, with the choke set, the crank at about 2 o'clock, push it down and and boom, it'd be running. The only time I hurt my arm was trying to do it as you suggested, which is what I'd been told by someone. Never again. You need to be able to drop the crank off the nut immediately. For a righthanded person, this is normal.

It was a regular voodoo ritual - I would unplug the magnetic heater I attached to the oilpan in the winter and take it inside, then set the choke, pump the carb twice quickly by hand and kick it over. It ALWAYS started right up, despite have loose screws from a poor carb rebuild the previous owner had done and a twig holding the float in place. (I found this out AFTER driving it to Oregon. ) BTW, you can fit a stagecoach trunk, three guitars, two toolboxes, a dog, multiple backpacks and skiis and LOTs of other stuff in an 88 if you are determined. Ask me how I know.

I had replaced the top gasket (homemade - it didn't have one -made it out of gasket material figuring something was better than nothing) and constantly was checking the screws on top of the carb, but never rebuilt it, as I knew it needed a new carb (the same idiot used whatever screws he found around his crash-pad to fix the carb. ) I planned on replacing the carb with a single barrel Weber, but I was broke, and once I cleaned it out and made a top gasket for it, it just ran...except for the screws loosening up - so once a week I'd snug them down. Crazy eh? I tried loctite, but the carb was too far gone.

Anyway, I'd adjust the choke slightly, then go in for another cup of coffee. By the time I finished and got my lunch together time the thing would be running a little ragged, and I'd wander out and push in the choke, then go back and hook up the dog, grab my lunch and go to work. That truck NEVER failed me, even in 20 below weather, under the worst conditions, and I never had to crank it more than 2X. If the tranny hadn't gone on me in Oregon and I hadn't needed a car, I'd still have it. Best vehicle I ever owned, but after starting the thing literally a thousand times (I lived with a crank for over 2 years) I can tell you, that's not the way to start a Landrover...unless you want to get hurt. So, no offense, but No.

One thing about crank starting - people just can't believe it. I'd stop for gas, then get out and tip it over (and that's all it takes with a loose engine on a warm day) and they would go wild. I had the top off one summer and some guy yelled "SEE ANY LIONS?" Too many Daktari episodes I guess.

Anyway, that IIa was the best vehicle I ever had, and not a shred of problem from Lucas, Prince of Darkness, once I figured out the brake lights problem it had when I bought it. It took three beers to make me start thinking like an Englishman!
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-29-2009, 12:42 AM
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You have to take into account with a petrol motor that you need power for the coil to work. No coil no start. So if your battery is dead flat, you won't be able to start it with a crank.

The early V8s use to have a crank fitting to the front pully and a crank hole in the bumper.
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-29-2009, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Morg308 View Post
Sorry, but I have to say BULLSHIT. I started my '67 type IIa for two winters in Jackson WY, often in subzero temps, and you will break your arm trying to pull up on it.
God watches over the young, the sick, and the ignorant.
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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-29-2009, 08:27 AM
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Good thing that, Terry.
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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 04-30-2009, 06:42 AM
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I feel I must add my 2 peneth, I have owned many British vehicles being a native an-all and most of them hand a starting handle or hand crank. My Dad was the one who taught me the right way and speaking from countless successful starts, no broken fingers etc I can say that this is the best way to start. I have done this with the first 2 turns with the ignition on and off and the only difference is a little kick when the igition is on;
Insert the handle and bring it to the just past 12 O'Clock, with your thumbs NOT wrapped around the handle but laying on top (if you get my meaning) and one hand over the other turn the engine over slowly twice. On the third go round (with the crank at the just past 12 position) push down and pull up in a kind of swing motion, nice and quick and smart. If the timing has been set right she will start.

The 2 turns you do before starting will draw fuel into the system. Like I said if you do this with the ignition on then you may feel a kick each time the crank reaches the top but as long as you turn it slowly you'll be ok and ALWAYS keep your thumbs like a monkey, cupped hands. It's a good indication that your timing is right, I used to set Morris Minors up using the starting handle as a guide as with worn distrubutors the book could be less than usful and you needed another way of ensuring that she'd start first time.

You will hear variations on this method but I personlly have found this to be the best and injury free.

Cheers then
Nic

What happens if I turn this .....oh
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