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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
After much deliberation I have chosen to remove the 4.0 and install a 5.7 small block using Marks 4WD kit.

I bought a 195 hp crate motor, the kit & headers, a new torque convertor to match the crank centering stub along with the flex plate. I plan on installing hi-flow cats then teeing into the stock back half exhaust as I like quiet performance.

A set of OME medium duty springs should carry the increased weight comfortably. Then all the plastic below the beltline is coming off, all of it tired of that as well. I have a new set of Michelin all terrains to go on after I'm done with the swap then the headlight upgrade, new paint and welcomed dependability.

I simply grew tired of the constant glitches of the 4.0 and control systems, but absolutely enjoy the truck and it's capabilities.
 

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After much deliberation I have chosen to remove the 4.0 and install a 5.7 small block using Marks 4WD kit.

I bought a 195 hp crate motor, the kit & headers, a new torque convertor to match the crank centering stub along with the flex plate. I plan on installing hi-flow cats then teeing into the stock back half exhaust as I like quiet performance.

A set of OME medium duty springs should carry the increased weight comfortably. Then all the plastic below the beltline is coming off, all of it tired of that as well. I have a new set of Michelin all terrains to go on after I'm done with the swap then the headlight upgrade, new paint and welcomed dependability.

I simply grew tired of the constant glitches of the 4.0 and control systems, but absolutely enjoy the truck and it's capabilities.
Curious. Is this kit specific to a D2? The sticking point to most conversions is to get the engine to talk to all the D2 electronics to retain all the other functions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Curious. Is this kit specific to a D2? The sticking point to most conversions is to get the engine to talk to all the D2 electronics to retain all the other functions.
The kit is for the D2 with HP22 trans. It is a direct bolt in utilizing 1/2 stock motor mount 1/2 GM isolator mount to bolt directly into the existing frame area without modification.

I'm disconnecting the FI for now and carbureting the engine. Later if I decide to run FI, my brother has had great success with an SDS stand alone system in a couple of cars he's built, tune-able fuel, ignition maps with a laptop provisions for wide spectrum o2's for emission acceptability.

The trans is easy to hookup for proper function, so it should be a weekend ordeal once the parts are collected. The only rub at this point are the headers, I need to send them to Jet Hot in Biloxi to be ceramic coated, that advantage is to great to pass on that took a couple weeks last time to get them back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I have all the primary parts (some in transient) necessary to do the swap from 4.0 to 5.7 in the Discovery

Certainly there will be other pieces needed as there always are but to date,
the new 5.7 crate motor (195 hp), Intake manifold, 600cfm carb, motor mounts, swap kit & early style torque converter totaled $3335.
After measuring via "eyeball" the room necessary for the right side exhaust down pipe and necessary clearance issues with non stock parts,
the early style "rams-horn" GM exhaust manifold from the 283-327 will fit just fine so I did not need to purchase the headers I was told I would need.
I will do the 2" medium lift spring, take the saved money from the headers, replace the bushings in the suspension with Delrin replacements. The torque output is more than the 4.0, to that end I'll find some HD drive-shafts to install before I take it in the woods and likely a few skid plates, other than these things, I think I'll just enjoy driving the thing.

Yesterday I checked with several reputable Rover shops concerning the cost of a 4.0 rebuild, including necessary engine sensors, injectors, some wiring, timing components, the estimates were in the $5-$8,000 range and dependent upon the level of machine work wanted for dependability. This engine has 139,000 miles, head gaskets have been replaced once, to me it's not worth the expenditure either to rebuild or replace with a re-manufactured 4.0. I'm not a purist and this is far from a classic, collectible truck.

All told I do believe this truck will be finished under $4500 with all the parts, but more importantly, dependable as a Chevrolet for the rest of its life with me.

Now I suppose I can work on the elimination of the oft returning 3 Amigos, like ghosts, they come and they go without rhyme nor reason.
 

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You still haven't made it clear how the Chevy motor is going to trick the LR ECU that there's still a Rover motor in it. That's one of the biggest hurdles with these D2's. And what I mean is that EVERYTHING still works. I followed a guy on another forum dropping a Isuzu Diesel into his D2. He spent massive amounts of time figuring out how to do this, and he was no slouch.
Are they selling some sort of wiring harness to accomplish this? What about the computer controlled trans?
Just playing the Devil's advocate, but the saying comes to mind: If it sounds to good to be true, it probably is.
I can almost guarantee you that if you could swap in a carbureted Chevy motor with headers into a D2 for 4500.00 and have the rest of the truck perform as factory, Mark's couldn't make the kits fast enough.
Prove me wrong and I'll eat my words and be the first one at their door for a kit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
You still haven't made it clear how the Chevy motor is going to trick the LR ECU that there's still a Rover motor in it. That's one of the biggest hurdles with these D2's. And what I mean is that EVERYTHING still works. I followed a guy on another forum dropping a Isuzu Diesel into his D2. He spent massive amounts of time figuring out how to do this, and he was no slouch.
Are they selling some sort of wiring harness to accomplish this? What about the computer controlled trans?
Just playing the Devil's advocate, but the saying comes to mind: If it sounds to good to be true, it probably is.
I can almost guarantee you that if you could swap in a carbureted Chevy motor with headers into a D2 for 4500.00 and have the rest of the truck perform as factory, Mark's couldn't make the kits fast enough.
Prove me wrong and I'll eat my words and be the first one at their door for a kit.
There is no trick to the install, no special harness to fool the problematic control unit into operation. I am eliminating the control unit completely at this time. There are sufficient and dependable stand alone control units on the market to control a sub-system if they are needed. If I decided later to fuel inject the motor, there are several self-learning, contained MPI systems available now for about $2500 that work exceptionally well with crank fired ignition systems like Electromotive or SDS units.

The two biggest deterrents to engine swaps is inexperience and
mis-information. I've been swapping drive-trains about 40 years finding that adaptability of poorly designed systems as opposed to replacement of those systems a roadblock many individuals waste an inordinate amount of time on & can not get around. With systems that perform as poorly as these systems do, why on earth would you consider keeping them in play?

There is no magic to this swap, the engine literally bolts into the chassis, the transmission that has been used in vehicles since 1980 when it was designed is adaptable to simplistic controls easily enough, 35 years ago there were no electronic controls for the transmission, a lock-up torque converter & pressure control cable is easy to correctly connect. As far as the other systems running through the control unit, they are easily segregated from the drive-train controller functions allowing them to operate with impunity. The drive-train controller is history.

The only things standing in the way of individuals overrunning Marks 4WD for kits is inability, inexperience, non sufficient tools and misinformation concerning the ease of drive-train upgrades. Even if the finished project went to $6,000 the dependability difference in the 2 drive-trains is immeasurable if you like the truck, which I do. At whatever price point, you have vanquished the demons that plague this vehicle.

I would never ask you to eat words, they tend to be overrated as sustenance, but I have done this so many times I will tell you with 100% certainty, the biggest cause of failure is believing the misinformation put out about the procedure, it's straight forward, get it driving then do the personal mods, this way you lose no momentum and you don't get bogged down.
 

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There is no trick to the install, no special harness to fool the problematic control unit into operation.
I think this may be more problematic than your anticipating. The electronic/controls of this vehicle are so in-bred that you cannot just simply eliminate one of them without depriving another of something it needs to fuction properly.

If I decided later to fuel inject the motor, there are several self-learning, contained MPI systems available now for about $2500 that work exceptionally well with crank fired ignition systems like Electromotive or SDS units.
Granted, but you've just added 2500.00 to your swap to get what is arguably the norm for almost every vehicle sold today and is far superior to a caburator for off-roading.

As far as the other systems running through the control unit, they are easily segregated from the drive-train controller functions allowing them to operate with impunity. The drive-train controller is history.
See above.

The only things standing in the way of individuals overrunning Marks 4WD for kits is inability, inexperience, non sufficient tools and misinformation concerning the ease of drive-train upgrades.
Unless you can point to years of LR experience, this statement is a bit condescending. You are not the first one to think of this and certainly not the only one with the capabilites to do it if it were as "straight-forward" as you are implying. True LR "experts" abound here and on other web-sites.

There are many at whatever price point, you have vanquished the demons that plague this vehicle.
What "demons" have you vanquished? Properly maintained, these trucks are every bit as reliable as anything else out there, if not more so.

Don't mis-interperet my playing "devils advocate" as being a dick-head. I'm also no LR purist (although I am a Ford guy), so a 351 would be my choice.:smile
I am a purist though, when it comes to my engine swaps. I dropped a 97 fuel injected 5.0 HO into a 84 Volvo sedan and if you popped the hood, it looked like it came from the factory that way.
If I could drive your converted D2 and an identical non-converted D2 side-by-side and not tell ANY difference except for the power, that to me is a sucessfull swap.
Please also track your time and expenses as I will also be following with interest and YES, hoping for your sucess as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I think this may be more problematic than your anticipating. The electronic/controls of this vehicle are so in-bred that you cannot just simply eliminate one of them without depriving another of something it needs to fuction properly.



Granted, but you've just added 2500.00 to your swap to get what is arguably the norm for almost every vehicle sold today and is far superior to a caburator for off-roading.



See above.



Unless you can point to years of LR experience, this statement is a bit condescending. You are not the first one to think of this and certainly not the only one with the capabilites to do it if it were as "straight-forward" as you are implying. True LR "experts" abound here and on other web-sites.



What "demons" have you vanquished? Properly maintained, these trucks are every bit as reliable as anything else out there, if not more so.

Don't mis-interperet my playing "devils advocate" as being a dick-head. I'm also no LR purist (although I am a Ford guy), so a 351 would be my choice.:smile
I am a purist though, when it comes to my engine swaps. I dropped a 97 fuel injected 5.0 HO into a 84 Volvo sedan and if you popped the hood, it looked like it came from the factory that way.
If I could drive your converted D2 and an identical non-converted D2 side-by-side and not tell ANY difference except for the power, that to me is a sucessfull swap.
Please also track your time and expenses as I will also be following with interest and YES, hoping for your sucess as well.

I'm not taking your comment as being anything adverse.

I applaud your Volvo 5.0 swap, Paul Newman did it in a wagon as a daily driver with great success. A company in California has been doing it for a couple decades, supposedly a great upgrade. The Ford fit better than the GM motor which is why it became the choice, same with XKE swaps the GM small block was wider then the Ford which fit better in the frame rails, it became common place as well for that reason, not so the later XJ 6 & 12, or the XJS, they received the GM small block for ease of installation. Johns Cars in Dallas is the guy to go to for this bolt in swap. I've done several, truly plug and play.

As I stated, this truck is not complicated, the sub-systems can be independently separated and controlled.

Sorry you believe the statement to be condescending concerning LR "Experts" I know a few, they left the dealerships years ago because of the junk built prior to BMW and now India's ownership of the brand. The truck sold here is problematic at best, the warranty repair index(thru 2004) leads the nation in cost per vehicle in this class, followed closely by Jeep during the warranty period. Statistically you are incorrect about the brand being as reliable as other vehicles in the class, they are far from that position, the warranty repair index bears out this point. You see I know a bit about service having retired as a Director of Fixed Operations of 47 franchises which included Land Rover. So stop being offended. I know a little something about building toys, costs, complications & comparisons.

If I decided to add FI later this would necessitate the upgrading of several components, drive-line as well as some other items and I'm in no hurry to do this. I drive the truck often but bought it to tow another toy i'm finishing to and from the launch ramp, I don't rock climb, play in the mud (anymore) or go places where there is no Hotel in which to relax. The cost really matters little when you build a thing for personal use with no intent of selling later, I have 2 sons and a grandson that would enjoy the thing and take care of it. Money's moot in this instance.

And there you have it, I'm an old guy with a complete shop in my backyard & 40 years of experience, I build what I want, the way I want it and do not let a little or a lot of criticism bother me at all. I don't take comments personally and believe you are entitled to your thoughts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I decided to reseal the 4.0 and install it in Rhonda's 72 MGB so she can have A/C and a V8 toy. Instead of yet another standard shift car, she asked me to make it an automatic. Simple enough I suppose. A small clearance issue exists with the boxed firewall, that will require modifying for V/C clearance but the sheet metal is readily available along with all other nit noid items for installation out of the UK and inexpensive to boot.

So nothing goes to waste, I did coils, wires, ABS shuttle valve mod, radiator hoses and a plethora of loose nuts and small fasteners tightening. I removed the "fart can rear half" of the exhaust system installing a factory part from the convertor back, ahhh the sound of silence, no more high school drone. I had to tighten all of the heat shields, did not hear them rattle with the other exhaust noise, nice to hear jazz again at a reasonably low decibel level. When the time comes, I will reseal the motor, replace the head gaskets again with studs and that should about take care of that.

Well productive and tiring Saturday, the truck is clean, ready to road trip back to Houston, can't wait to get the 5.7 in the truck, parts arrive slowly and I'm still impatient when playing with toys. Take Care.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Very nice, Doug. I can wait for the pics. It sounds like you know your way around a vehicle. I look forward to the updates on the Rover.


Colin
Hello Colin,

I will post occasionally with photos, research shows the swap to be straight forward. well thought out by previous builders, we know small issues arise and personal preference takes it's toll on time but there is no hurry, I have other fun things to drive, driving back from Baton Rouge today the truck returned 17.542 mpg @ posted speed limits, representing a 3.3 mpg increase prior to coils and wires on the same leg last time. Don't believe it will get much better, but I can live with this, it's an improvement. I removed the heated coolant from the throttle as well, installed a K&N filter, set the tire pressures and rolled on out.
At any rate thanks for the kind encouragement concerning the swap. Be they hold their own in Denver's winter. Take Care.

Doug
 

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Beware removing the throttle body heater. Most people will tell you, "oh yea, no big deal", but research and find the guys that have had their throttles freeze in position. Can be a real big deal.
Also, are you talking a K&N air filter? If so, get rid of it now! Discovery's hate these filters. The oil from the filter really wreaks havoc on the MAF sensor.
 

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Hello Colin,

I will post occasionally with photos, research shows the swap to be straight forward. well thought out by previous builders, we know small issues arise and personal preference takes it's toll on time but there is no hurry, I have other fun things to drive, driving back from Baton Rouge today the truck returned 17.542 mpg @ posted speed limits, representing a 3.3 mpg increase prior to coils and wires on the same leg last time. Don't believe it will get much better, but I can live with this, it's an improvement. I removed the heated coolant from the throttle as well, installed a K&N filter, set the tire pressures and rolled on out.
At any rate thanks for the kind encouragement concerning the swap. Be they hold their own in Denver's winter. Take Care.

Doug

17.5 is pretty darn good. That's what I averaged in my D1 on the highway, but most people seem to be getting in the low teens, so I felt I was doing pretty well.

There are a ton of Land Rovers out here. As you can imagine, they do quite well.

As far as the K&N my '97 had one on it the whole time I owned it. It was installed by the previous owner. I never had any issues. With that said, my recommendation would be to clean the MAF sensor several times for a period of time after you clean and re-oil the filter. After that you should be fine.


Colin
 

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17.5 is pretty darn good. That's what I averaged in my D1 on the highway, but most people seem to be getting in the low teens, so I felt I was doing pretty well.

There are a ton of Land Rovers out here. As you can imagine, they do quite well.

As far as the K&N my '97 had one on it the whole time I owned it. It was installed by the previous owner. I never had any issues. With that said, my recommendation would be to clean the MAF sensor several times for a period of time after you clean and re-oil the filter. After that you should be fine.


Colin
Problem with that is, every time you remove/clean the MAF, you run the risk of damaging it. Don't know about D1's, but there's plenty of anecdotal evidence that D2's suffer as a result of them. Both of my D2's absolutely ran like crap until I switched to paper filters. And yes, I know how to clean/oil a K&N filter. Better just run a good paper filter.
 

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Problem with that is, every time you remove/clean the MAF, you run the risk of damaging it. Don't know about D1's, but there's plenty of anecdotal evidence that D2's suffer as a result of them. Both of my D2's absolutely ran like crap until I switched to paper filters. And yes, I know how to clean/oil a K&N filter. Better just run a good paper filter.
Definitely agree with you. I'm not saying people don't have problems, I'm just one person who didn't have any. Realistically, I could be the only one. I figured since the OP had already bought it and was using it I'd give my best advise if he was going to continue to use it.

I think it is common knowledge now that K&N air filters allow more fine particles to get past in comparison to paper filters regardless of the vehicle they're installed in. I prefer paper filters.


Colin
 

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This needs to be a build thread.

If it's as simple as claimed to basically hardwire the subsystems then I feel LS swaps coming in the future.

Best of luck to you! Pictures are king!
 

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This needs to be a build thread.

If it's as simple as claimed to basically hardwire the subsystems then I feel LS swaps coming in the future.

Best of luck to you! Pictures are king!
If it were as "simple" as he's claiming, it would already have been done countless times over. This and other forums are littered with people claiming they have found an "easy" way to do it.
It's one thing to Frankenstein something together, but as I stated before, any swap I would sign on for MUST leave everything else intact. That's why I bought a D2.
We'll see.
 
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