[SafariDave]

Looking for a winchless bumper with bull bar for the D2, with or without headlight protection. I like the TJM. Or just a Bull bar. Options? Recommendations.
Dave

 

[WLADiscoII99]

I asked this question and other questions about bull bars and was ignored.

I am being told it depends on the year of your Rover. One guy said a 2004 LR Bullbar will fit a 1999 LR Bullbar. Some other thread said it won't. I don't know what a "TJM" is. All I know is I hate the ARB Bull bars. They are basic, ugly looking, and expensive.

You're not saying what year you Rover is but I'm told one thing than another. At this point I think my safest option is to buy a 1999 Bullbar (very ugly) from a junkyard and restore it. Grind off the rust, paint thick and gloss. Maybe cut out the metal lamp guards.

I found a really cool bullbar online for an 04.... it's made from metal and rubber and polyester.. but I cannot give you the link until I get an answer if it will fit on the 1999 because I want it on my rig.

 

[p76rangie]

The answer is unless you really need one, do not put one on.
Car manufacturers are trying to make their cars lighter and lighter for better performance and fuel economy. Then on 4WDs the owners insist on adding a lot of weight in the form of roof racks, bull bars, rear bars, larger heavier tyres, etc, etc. Then they complain about the fuel economy and performance.

 

[WLADiscoII99]

The answer is unless you really need one, do not put one on.
Car manufacturers are trying to make their cars lighter and lighter for better performance and fuel economy. Then on 4WDs the owners insist on adding a lot of weight in the form of roof racks, bull bars, rear bars, larger heavier tyres, etc, etc. Then they complain about the fuel economy and performance.

You really need one.

1) They look awesome
2) They protect the car from accidents

There are some stories about Rover owners getting into 35MPH accidents head on that were saved with a Bull bar. They are super cool and were included as an option when these cars were originally sold.


I feel Land rover shoud've used a V10 or V12 to accomodate. But car manufacturers want to build the cheapest car for the biggest profit.

 

[WLADiscoII99]

The answer is unless you really need one, do not put one on.
Car manufacturers are trying to make their cars lighter and lighter for better performance and fuel economy. Then on 4WDs the owners insist on adding a lot of weight in the form of roof racks, bull bars, rear bars, larger heavier tyres, etc, etc. Then they complain about the fuel economy and performance.

How is a fully loaded Land Rover (bull bar, lift, mud tires, roof rack, snorkel, guards, jerry cans etc.) any different than a Land Rover full of passengers? weight is weight ..

 

[sierrafery]

....They are super cool and were included as an option when these cars were originally sold.

IMO beside that they are ugly they restrict 1/4 of the air flow through the radiator or even more if spots are fitted there too... i'd not put one on other than a safari or pure off-road vehicle, it seems that they are not ''cool'' at all: Crash or Bull Bars Cause More Danger than they Prevent | Advanced Drivers of North America

How is a fully loaded Land Rover (bull bar, lift, mud tires, roof rack, snorkel, guards, jerry cans etc.) any different than a Land Rover full of passengers? weight is weight

What's fitted on the vehicle is permanent and added to the passenger's weight while passengers are sporadic, i agree that weight is weight but putting extra weight on a vehicle just for the cool look of of it should be illegal IMO(as it is in some states of the world)... the braking distance is increased by unnecessary extra weight and the vehicle can become a danger for others cos it's loaded with all kind of useless crap just to have a "macho" look :serious

 

[sierrafery]

Looking for a winchless bumper with bull bar for the D2, with or without headlight protection. I like the TJM. Or just a Bull bar. Options? Recommendations.
Dave

If you insist to fit one the original's p/n for pre facelift is STC50022

 

[SafariDave]

LOL, guys my truck will be used in Puerto Rico, where a big storm devastated the island. We own a house there near the beach. I will be driving to beaches that have no roads, with branches and other obstacles and things that my D2 will need protection for in the front. I will also be adding lights on the bumper since the island has weekly lights out and I will need that to see where I am going in the forest areas when its pitch dark. This bumper is not for looks, but a necessity.
Dave

 

[p76rangie]

There are some stories about Rover owners getting into 35MPH accidents head on that were saved with a Bull bar.

Do you actually believe this stuff.
The D1 onwards have an invention called airbags that are designed to act at a certain time after impact down to the millisecond. Bull bars alter the crush characteristics of the car and can affect when the airbag should be deployed and when it is actually employed. So having a bullbar can actually increase your chance of injury rather than reduce it. You are going to want those airbags to work properly if you hit something solid at 35mph. But if you are talking about a "head on" at 35mph, it means that the other car was probably doing 35mph as well, giving a combined speed of 70mph.

Then there is the issue of a front corner impact. Without a bullbar you will replace the headlight, hood, front guard, etc. With a bull bar you will bend the chassis and start looking for another vehicle. Of course steel flexes and you will still most likely be up for the other parts as well.

 

[masantschi]

There are some stories about Rover owners getting into 35MPH accidents head on that were saved with a Bull bar. They are super cool and were included as an option when these cars were originally sold.

I'd be interested in knowing where some of these stories came from? It changes your safety system.

Also WLA, when are you going 35 MPH, aside from Starting and Stopping? At 90-100 MPH, that bull bar doesn't do diddly squat.

 

[p76rangie]

LOL, guys my truck will be used in Puerto Rico, where a big storm devastated the island. We own a house there near the beach. I will be driving to beaches that have no roads, with branches and other obstacles and things that my D2 will need protection for in the front. I will also be adding lights on the bumper since the island has weekly lights out and I will need that to see where I am going in the forest areas when its pitch dark. This bumper is not for looks, but a necessity.
Dave

Does not sound like you are going to hit anything too solid, so maybe you should look for a aluminium or plastic bullbar.
Land Rover Discovery ECB Alloy Bullbar Nudge Bars Bull Bars Series Series 2 (2/99 -10/02)
https://www.formulaoffroad.com.au/find-my-vehicle/land-rover-discovery-bull-bar-299-2002-series-2/

 

[SafariDave]

Does not sound like you are going to hit anything too solid, so maybe you should look for a aluminium or plastic bullbar.
Land Rover Discovery ECB Alloy Bullbar Nudge Bars Bull Bars Series Series 2 (2/99 -10/02)
https://www.formulaoffroad.com.au/find-my-vehicle/land-rover-discovery-bull-bar-299-2002-series-2/

I am fine with lighter Bull bars, but those are in Australia, not in the US. Been trying to find them here. I was originally just looking for a brush bar A bar just for the front.
Dave

 

[p76rangie]

I am fine with lighter Bull bars, but those are in Australia, not in the US. Been trying to find them here. I was originally just looking for a brush bar A bar just for the front.
Dave

I am not sure what you have in the US. You listed TJM which is an Australian company, ARB is also an Australian company. So it seems like you get a lot of Australian product there.

 

[WLADiscoII99]

I'd be interested in knowing where some of these stories came from? It changes your safety system.

Also WLA, when are you going 35 MPH, aside from Starting and Stopping? At 90-100 MPH, that bull bar doesn't do diddly squat.

This website. For starters, And various other comments Iv'e been reading. Thousands and thousands.


In the driveway.

 

[redtruck12]

You really need one.

1) They look awesome
2) They protect the car from accidents

There are some stories about Rover owners getting into 35MPH accidents head on that were saved with a Bull bar. They are super cool and were included as an option when these cars were originally sold.


I feel Land rover shoud've used a V10 or V12 to accomodate. But car manufacturers want to build the cheapest car for the biggest profit.

I understand what dave is looking for and sounds like he needs a tough, lightweight bumper

"Off-road use" not to look cool, not to "pose" and "look cool " driving on paved roads.
Heavy duty bumpers are not designed to strengthen a vehicle in a collision and really the do not. Manufacturers have designed crush zones to protect occupants not to protect vehicles adding what is basically a battering ram to the front of your vehicle can actually do more damage than a stock bumper.

Heeps with ever ridiculous aftermarket dodad available are common in my area and in my opinion should be made illegal in some cases. The combination of big tires, suspension lifts and add on stinger bumpers are in my opinion weapons!

Vehicle manufacturers need to meet standards so vehicles hit bumper to bumper (to some extent) ..... What happens when you increase height by 3" or more and get involved in a collision? BAD NEWS!!!!

Don't be this guy
And please feel free to share where you read they reduce damage in a collision, I can't recall reading many positive except for "real offroad use"

 

[redtruck12]

This website. For starters, And various other comments Iv'e been reading. Thousands and thousands.


In the driveway.

??????????
Yes a 04 bumper "bull bar" will fit on a 99 with modifications (please don't ask what modifications) numerous modifications.
It will also fit on a Buick or a Volkswagen with modifications

If you are building a real offroad machine look into it if you just want to look cool....... Hmmmmm

 

[WLADiscoII99]

I understand what dave is looking for and sounds like he needs a tough, lightweight bumper

"Off-road use" not to look cool, not to "pose" and "look cool " driving on paved roads.
Heavy duty bumpers are not designed to strengthen a vehicle in a collision and really the do not. Manufacturers have designed crush zones to protect occupants not to protect vehicles adding what is basically a battering ram to the front of your vehicle can actually do more damage than a stock bumper.

Heeps with ever ridiculous aftermarket dodad available are common in my area and in my opinion should be made illegal in some cases. The combination of big tires, suspension lifts and add on stinger bumpers are in my opinion weapons!

Vehicle manufacturers need to meet standards so vehicles hit bumper to bumper (to some extent) ..... What happens when you increase height by 3" or more and get involved in a collision? BAD NEWS!!!!

Don't be this guy
And please feel free to share where you read they reduce damage in a collision, I can't recall reading many positive except for "real offroad use"

You sound like a liberal.


I see what you're saying when you say they can do more damage. But do you mean damage to your car or the other car? Also if you have the right material, specifically the bull bars that were discontinued like this:

These could actually help both people in an accident. It's made of rubber and polyester over a steel frame. One poster implied he crashed at 50 MPH and it took out the bumper but not the car:


https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/wrap-around-soft-bull-bar-stc50020.161320/


I found other comments on other forums too. One had a photo. But I've read so many thousands of comments I would have to do all that work again.

I am trying to get the bumper I found from an outdated catalogue here: https://rimmerbros.com/images/PDFs/Discovery2.pdf

BULL BAR STC50020

But it's obselete. There is only 2 other bars I can find that fit. The original and the ARB. Both are solid steel. I don't want solid steel I want anything similar to the STC50020 but I've been searching for months and there is nothing. I found this which is still for sale:

But it's a 2004. And nobody will tell me if a 2004 will fit a 1999.

 

[WLADiscoII99]

??????????
Yes a 04 bumper "bull bar" will fit on a 99 with modifications (please don't ask what modifications) numerous modifications.
It will also fit on a Buick or a Volkswagen with modifications

If you are building a real offroad machine look into it if you just want to look cool....... Hmmmmm

What kind of modifications? :wink

 

[p76rangie]

Don't be this guy
And please feel free to share where you read they reduce damage in a collision, I can't recall reading many positive except for "real offroad use"

Thankfully those type of bars seem to be a US thing. Have seen them being fitted on a few US TV shows.

This is the warning that our equivalent of the DMV issues:
Before fitting a bull bar or similar equipment to a vehicle the following should be considered.
• Bull bars may provide some protection to the front of the vehicle in low speed collisions. However, they are likely to be of little or no benefit in most other situations.
• A bull bar fitted to a passenger vehicle may result in greater injuries to other road users such as pedestrians, cyclists or motorcyclists in a crash situation.
• Bull bars may also reduce the designed impact absorption of a vehicle’s front structure and panels, which are intended to crumple in a collision, and
to minimise the forces imposed on the vehicle’s occupants. Bull bars may also reduce the effectiveness of collapsible steering columns.
• The operation of a secondary restraint system, such as an air bag, in a crash situation may be adversely affected if a bull bar is fitted to the vehicle.

Then these are the actual national rules for Bullbars:
The bull bar must be designed and fitted so that the safety of the vehicle is not adversely affected. It must be firmly and securely mounted and supported, and must not constitute a danger to other road users.
• The bull bar must not obstruct the vision of the driver and should not project further beyond the front of the vehicle than is necessary for its attachment.
• The bull bar and any fittings, hooks or attachments must not have any sharp edges, corners or protrusions, nor should it extend unduly beyond the side profile of the vehicle.
• All exposed sections of the bull bar and fittings must be radiused and deburred; forward and side members, should be designed to minimise the risk of injury to any person who may come into contact with the bull bar.
• The profile of the bull bar should follow that of the vehicle in plan, side and front view.
• The bull bar or fittings must not obstruct or affect the performance or visibility of head lamps, parking lamps, turn signal lamps or other mandatory lamps.
• The bull bar, together with its mountings and any winch or other equipment and fittings, must be taken into account for vehicle dimensions.
• Any part of a winch, fittings or other equipment which project forward of the bull bar, must not have any sharp edges or be an unsafe projection. Alternatively they should be enclosed with a suitable cover which is itself free from protrusions or sharp edges.
• Fittings such as driving lamp brackets or fishing rod holders must not protrude above the top or forward of the bull bar.

 

[WLADiscoII99]

Thankfully those type of bars seem to be a US thing. Have seen them being fitted on a few US TV shows.

This is the warning that our equivalent of the DMV issues:
Before fitting a bull bar or similar equipment to a vehicle the following should be considered.
• Bull bars may provide some protection to the front of the vehicle in low speed collisions. However, they are likely to be of little or no benefit in most other situations.
• A bull bar fitted to a passenger vehicle may result in greater injuries to other road users such as pedestrians, cyclists or motorcyclists in a crash situation.
• Bull bars may also reduce the designed impact absorption of a vehicle’s front structure and panels, which are intended to crumple in a collision, and
to minimise the forces imposed on the vehicle’s occupants. Bull bars may also reduce the effectiveness of collapsible steering columns.
• The operation of a secondary restraint system, such as an air bag, in a crash situation may be adversely affected if a bull bar is fitted to the vehicle.

Then these are the actual national rules for Bullbars:
The bull bar must be designed and fitted so that the safety of the vehicle is not adversely affected. It must be firmly and securely mounted and supported, and must not constitute a danger to other road users.
• The bull bar must not obstruct the vision of the driver and should not project further beyond the front of the vehicle than is necessary for its attachment.
• The bull bar and any fittings, hooks or attachments must not have any sharp edges, corners or protrusions, nor should it extend unduly beyond the side profile of the vehicle.
• All exposed sections of the bull bar and fittings must be radiused and deburred; forward and side members, should be designed to minimise the risk of injury to any person who may come into contact with the bull bar.
• The profile of the bull bar should follow that of the vehicle in plan, side and front view.
• The bull bar or fittings must not obstruct or affect the performance or visibility of head lamps, parking lamps, turn signal lamps or other mandatory lamps.
• The bull bar, together with its mountings and any winch or other equipment and fittings, must be taken into account for vehicle dimensions.
• Any part of a winch, fittings or other equipment which project forward of the bull bar, must not have any sharp edges or be an unsafe projection. Alternatively they should be enclosed with a suitable cover which is itself free from protrusions or sharp edges.
• Fittings such as driving lamp brackets or fishing rod holders must not protrude above the top or forward of the bull bar.

It looks super cool - and some protection is better than protection.
Land Rover Discovery's don't crumple in a collision. That's actually whats very scary about them. They can crush your legs off at the kneecaps. There is a video online somewhere showing what happens with dummies in the car. I forget where I saw it.


Do the police in Australia enforce these regulations on the streets?